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Deuteronomy 21:15-17 - 10/10/2008 2:35:57 PM
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Fledgling
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The Right of the Firstborn
15.If a man has two wives, and he loves one but not the other, and both bear him sons but the firstborn is the son of the wife he does not love,
16.when he wills his property to his sons, he must not give the rights of the firstborn to the son of the wife he loves in preference to his actual firstborn, the son of the wife he does not love.
17.He must acknowledge the son of his unloved wife as the firstborn by giving him a double share of all he has. That son is the first sign of his father's strength. The right of the firstborn belongs to him.
Why was the man with two wives not considered an adulterer after he married his second wife after the first? Why was the second wife not considered an adulterer as she married an already married man. When and why did the meaning of the marriage vow change in the bible?
If you are not allowed to remarry after divorce then why was it ok to marry while married in Deuteronomy?
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RE: Deuteronomy 21:15-17 - 10/10/2008 2:54:58 PM
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JimboFletch
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Maybe it's because we're no longer under the old covenant. Maybe it's because God put up with men having more than one wife under the Law, then demanded we grow up as humans since He came in the flesh.
What do you think?
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RE: Deuteronomy 21:15-17 - 10/10/2008 3:24:13 PM
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Fledgling
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Thanks JimboFletch,
That does make sence to me.
So when I read the OT, if the laws were meant for humans that were not "grown up" as we are now since He has come into our flesh.. What meaning do the OT laws have for me? What am I suppose to understand from reading them?
Why was God not as strict with men as women in the OT? In Dueteronomy 21:15-17 it was ok for a man to marry a woman when he was not a virgin and even already married... but yet in Deuteronomy 22:14-21 women who could not provide proof of virginity before marriage were stoned in front of their father's door.
Deuteronomy 22:14-21
Now he has slandered her and said, 'I did not find your daughter to be a virgin.' But here is the proof of my daughter's virginity." Then her parents shall display the cloth before the elders of the town,
and the elders shall take the man and punish him.
They shall fine him a hundred shekels of silver and give them to the girl's father, because this man has given an Israelite virgin a bad name. She shall continue to be his wife; he must not divorce her as long as he lives.
If, however, the charge is true and no proof of the girl's virginity can be found,
she shall be brought to the door of her father's house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done a disgraceful thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father's house. You must purge the evil from among you.
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RE: Deuteronomy 21:15-17 - 10/10/2008 3:24:37 PM
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DougHorton
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From: Georgia
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Because our culture's morals do not line up with God's standards. Let's look at God's standards in scripture, first.
Monogamy has been a principle of scripture from Genesis, but never a commandment.
If a man is married to more than one woman, it is not adultery. Marriage makes the difference.
A man can marry multiple wives, but a woman cannot marry multiple men unless the first husband is dead. In order to protect women against men's sin, he allowed them to divorce. I'm not saying that this was best, but it was allowed at the time scripture was written.
Since then, a polygamist has not been allowed to hold a church office, but polygamy was still not forbidden.
Western countries have taken this principle of monogamy and made it law. (However, as Easterners point out, we only replaced polygamy with serial-polygamy.) Some churches have taken it even further and have said an adulterer is anyone married to more than one person throughout their life, except for death of the spouse.
If you have been told that you are not allowed to remarry, you need to realize this is a distortion of scriptural principles. You are allowed to remarry. What scripture says is that if you are marry a woman who was divorced, you are causing her to become an adulteress, unless she already was an adulteress. This is because God does not recognize human divorce. A sexual relationship is spiritually binding, so much so that in ancient Israel, it was considered marriage.
Now here is the kicker most churches ignore: God forgives adultery just like He forgives obesity, gossips, and laziness.
_____________________________
Doug
You may think it strange, but he never likes any assistance. When he made the world, he did not ask the angel Gabriel so much as to cool the molten matter with his wing, but he did it entirely himself. -- Spurgeon
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RE: Deuteronomy 21:15-17 - 10/10/2008 4:13:57 PM
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Fledgling
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Thank you DougHorton,
I have found several passages in the bible that discourage an "elder" of having more than one wife.. I suppose that is where the idea came from that someone could not be a polygamist and hold a church office.. below is the passage from Titus 1.
Titus' Task on Crete
5The reason I left you in Crete was that you might straighten out what was left unfinished and appoint[a] elders in every town, as I directed you. 6An elder must be blameless, the husband of but one wife, a man whose children believe and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient.
also 1 Timothy 3:2
2Now the overseer must be above reproach, the husband of but one wife, temperate, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach,
1 Timothy 3:12
12A deacon must be the husband of but one wife and must manage his children and his household well.
I was not able to find a list of sins that are forgiven and sins not forgiven, but according to 1 John 1:5 all our sins can be forgiven.
1 John 1:5
Walking in the light
5This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all. 6If we claim to have fellowship with him yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live by the truth. 7But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.
What I am learning from this is.. that you can remarry because adultry/divorce is a forgivable sin.. and if you ask forgiveness you can be forgiven for the divorce/adultry.. and re-take the vow and begin again in a christian marriage.
I also can not find a reference to not allowing a man to have more then one wife.. but Polygamy is definately not looked on favorably in the NT... in most places the NT speaks of marriage as one man and one woman. And you can assume that it is "reproachable" to have more then one wife.. from 1 Timothy 3:2...
I guess serial-polygamy would be getting divorced and remarried.. there by having more than one wife... just only one at a time.
Thanks for your guidance :-) I think I am able to understand this now.
< Message edited by Fledgling -- 10/10/2008 4:22:44 PM >
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RE: Deuteronomy 21:15-17 - 10/10/2008 5:07:59 PM
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Bluethread
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Discussions like is tend to breakdown into "That's not fair" arguments because of the cut and paste approach to morality. Whether or not one accepts the moral code recorded by Moses as applicable, it is more than a series of arbitrary laws with only the purpose of illustrating the life and work of the Messiah. As Owens-Corning says, "There's a system to these things." Many of the laws of the USA would seem rather unfair if they were taken out of that legal code and placed in the legal code of another country. So, to say we don't live under that code, does nothing to answer the question. One must at least be willing to point out how the statute fits into the moral code from whch it was taken.
_____________________________
"Show me wherein I have errored and I will hold my tongue." Iyov(Job)
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RE: Deuteronomy 21:15-17 - 10/10/2008 5:27:55 PM
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ta_mosquito
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From: from MN, now in Ontario :D
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MODERATOR'S NOTE :: ATTENTION PLEASE
Please take discussion about divorce/remarriage to THIS THREAD. You may discuss it in a general sense here since it's part of the question, but do not turn this into a discussion about remarriage after divorce.
Thanks!
Tricia
Forums Moderator
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RE: Deuteronomy 21:15-17 - 10/10/2008 6:52:11 PM
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DougHorton
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From: Georgia
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quote:
I also can not find a reference to not allowing a man to have more then one wife.. but Polygamy is definately not looked on favorably in the NT... in most places the NT speaks of marriage as one man and one woman. And you can assume that it is "reproachable" to have more then one wife.. from 1 Timothy 3:2...
It also happens to be illegal, unless you want to move to the Middle East or Southeast Asia.
quote:
I guess serial-polygamy would be getting divorced and remarried.. there by having more than one wife... just only one at a time.
Right. I had never thought about it that way until talking to Muslims in the Middle East. This was how they described their observations of Western lifestyles.
_____________________________
Doug
You may think it strange, but he never likes any assistance. When he made the world, he did not ask the angel Gabriel so much as to cool the molten matter with his wing, but he did it entirely himself. -- Spurgeon
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RE: Deuteronomy 21:15-17 - 10/11/2008 2:02:05 PM
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Bluethread
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DougHorton
quote:
I also can not find a reference to not allowing a man to have more then one wife.. but Polygamy is definately not looked on favorably in the NT... in most places the NT speaks of marriage as one man and one woman. And you can assume that it is "reproachable" to have more then one wife.. from 1 Timothy 3:2...
It also happens to be illegal, unless you want to move to the Middle East or Southeast Asia.
quote:
I guess serial-polygamy would be getting divorced and remarried.. there by having more than one wife... just only one at a time.
Right. I had never thought about it that way until talking to Muslims in the Middle East. This was how they described their observations of Western lifestyles.
This is why, I believe, we should not base our morality on the legal code of the USA. I would think a polygamist marrage in accordance with the Word of the Creator is much more healthy for children than the "serial-polygamy" and "single parent households" we see today. For as the passage in question points out, one is not to denigh children there rights based on the actions and preferences of the parents.
_____________________________
"Show me wherein I have errored and I will hold my tongue." Iyov(Job)
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