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How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 12:29:53 PM
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christsgirl
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Many of you have read my posts about my marriage and know my history. If not, feel free to read them. Anyways, I'm soo torn at the moment. I am married to a man that does not in anyway share my core values (honesty, integrity, faithfulness to God, etc.) and I am just so tired of trying. At this point, I don't see him trying. In fact, the other day, he told me "we're just different; we're incompatible; maybe we really should just go our separate ways and we'll both be happier". I would love nothing more than a fresh start. I know for a fact now that I can't change him. And I'm tired of trying. But of course there's the struggle in my mind with the whole divorce and remarriage issue. And I refuse to live alone for the rest of my life. So, how did you know it was time to call it quits with your spouse? I need some help here. Help me sort through all of this.
Christsgirl
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 12:34:52 PM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6051
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: WA
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I did not give up on my marriage until the day he married his mistress.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 12:45:05 PM
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dianetavegia
Posts: 1825
Joined: 8/23/2005
From: Southern Baptist, Non Calvinist, Pro Life Ga. girl
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I hope no one will encourage you to consider divorce, since you have NO grounds.
Scripture is so clear about God's opinion of divorce and gives very limited reasons for dissolution of that covenant.
This man did not change after marriage, tho you may have been blind to his faults.
Malachi 2:13 And this is the second thing you do: You cover the altar of the Lord with tears, With weeping and crying; So He does not regard the offering anymore, Nor receive it with goodwill from your hands. 14 Yet you say, "For what reason?" Because the Lord has been witness Between you and the wife of your youth, With whom you have dealt treacherously; Yet she is your companion And your wife by covenant. 15 But did He not make them one, Having a remnant of the Spirit? And why one? He seeks godly offspring. Therefore take heed to your spirit, And let none deal treacherously with the wife of his youth. 16 "For the Lord God of Israel says That He hates divorce, For it covers one's garment with violence," Says the Lord of hosts. "Therefore take heed to your spirit, That you do not deal treacherously."
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 12:53:29 PM
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christsgirl
Posts: 45
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Diane -
I did not understand the first part of that scripture. Can you explain it to me?
I know that I don't currently have grounds for divorce because my husband has not physically cheated (that I know of) and he has not left me. However, with the stuff that he's into (specifically, the porn), and the current state of our marriage (we barely even talk) I don't suspect that it will be long before he does. And honestly, I'm almost waiting for him to so that I have grounds to leave ( I know some will probably think I'm silly for saying such a thing, but it's truly how I feel).
Just because I made the mistake of marrying him, I don't believe God has called me to live in a life of misery. Marrying an unbeliever (or divorcing) is not the unpardonable sin - blasphemy is.
Christsgirl
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 1:22:21 PM
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Zhi
Posts: 656
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Well, no, divorce is not unpardonable, but God never promised that our lives would be without misery. Look at the life of Paul. Most of his letters were sent from prison, he was shipwrecked, and dealt with a physical ailment that as far as I know, God never cured him of. Most of the original apostles were martyred. John was a prisoner on the Roman version of Alcatraz for most of his later years. Jesus Himself suffered horribly and was crucified. So, while I certainly don't know if this marriage is the cross that God has called you to, you had really better spend some time really talking to Him about it before you write it off simply because you think the Christian life should be all peaches and cream and no unpleasantness or sorrow.
Honestly, I know how you feel. There was a time when I really couldn't see any hope for my marriage either. Not only did my husband have similar problems to yours, but he didn't have a job, didn't have any desire to get one, didn't lift a finger around the house, and would go into fits of rage in which things would get broken and I truly feared for my safety. But, I am glad to say that all that was years ago. With a great deal of help from God, we got out of that mess and we have a terrific marriage now.
You need to be praying for your marriage constantly, and you need to get good Christian counselling (I know you posted polls about doing so, but I'm not sure if you actually have.) Even if he won't go, you need to. You also need to commit to your marriage and make the effort to save it. Yes, he still might leave. I understand that. But, at the darkest time in my marriage, I made the commitment that I wanted to be able to stand before God when this life is over, and when He asks me, honestly say that I did everything I could, that I never gave up, because I think that's what He will expect of me. I'm not saying that things will turn out well like they did for me, though I will pray that they do. But I AM saying that regardless of what he does, it's still your responsibility to try to make your marriage work. Concentrate on you, not on him, get the help you need, make the efforts you must, so that you will be blameless in this matter. That is all you can do.
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The optimist says the glass is half full. The pessimist says the glass is half empty. The engineer says the glass is twice as large as it needs to be.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 1:33:13 PM
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SNJCB4
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Christsgirl
I have been in your shoes, and some days I am in your shoes. I want to offer you the best advice I have recived. Stop focusing on your husband, and Focus on you. You spend your mental life on his falling from grace. Your heart is destroyed moment by moment as your thoughts run over his sins. Don't feel bad I do it too!!!!!
The crazy thing is when I started little things like going out to get my nails done instead of doing them myself. And telling him no to things I used to do for him that he can do for himself. He started to follow me and drop his addictions, little by little. When I make me important and valuable, not just SAY so he starts to notice me.
I would like for you to try to ask your sself deep in your heart search your soul if God is first?
is Christsgirl second? you should be.
Hubby is third?
Take a week and treat yourself see if you notice anything. 
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The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference. The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference. The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference. And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.
Elie Wiesel
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 1:38:22 PM
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christsgirl
Posts: 45
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Zhi, thanks for your post. I appreciate the things you said.
I don't feel that the christian life is supposed to be peaches and cream - I really don't. But is it supposed to be worse than the sinner's? I mean, my life is so miserable, I wish that God just didn't create me, honestly. I'm tired of the daily struggles with no break-throughs. I HAVE prayed for my marriage. I talk to God all the time, but He does not talk back. I pray for my marriage - stil no change. I work on myself - still I'm sad and lonely.
And as for counseling - I really am starting to despise the word. I have gone to counseling numerous times, although never faithfully. But the times I've gone, it has not helped me one bit. I feel like it's a waste of time and money that I don't have to waste. And I've gone to at least 5 different counselors over the years.
Honestly, I'm kinda mad at God for several reasons - for allowing me to marry this man, for condemning me to a life of misery (because He doesn't want me to remarry), and for not answering me when I reach out to Him. I'm at the point where I don't want to pray, don't wanna read my bible, go to church or anything because He doesn't answer and meet me where I am. I just can't reach him.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 1:41:33 PM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6051
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From: WA
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quote:
I know that I don't currently have grounds for divorce because my husband has not physically cheated (that I know of) and he has not left me. However, with the stuff that he's into (specifically, the porn), and the current state of our marriage (we barely even talk) I don't suspect that it will be long before he does. And honestly, I'm almost waiting for him to so that I have grounds to leave ( I know some will probably think I'm silly for saying such a thing, but it's truly how I feel).
Just because I made the mistake of marrying him, I don't believe God has called me to live in a life of misery. Marrying an unbeliever (or divorcing) is not the unpardonable sin - blasphemy is.
Murder is not an unpardonable sin, either, but if I told you that I was hoping a person I did not like would break into my house so that I could shoot him, you'd be appalled.
You are married. Period. YOU need to do all you can for your marriage. When you took your vows you did not say, "I'll do my part as long as he does his." You could very well be God's provision for your husband's salvation, but not as long as you are fighting God on the issue. So quit looking for a way out and start looking for a way up.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 1:45:27 PM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6051
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From: WA
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quote:
I just can't reach him.
Certainly not on your own terms, but you can on His, or rather, He can reach you.
Why are you blaming God for your decisions, by the way? God did not make you marry your husband--you chose to. And God is not wanting you to be unhappy, He is asking you to be faithful during a trying time.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 1:51:22 PM
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laura...
Posts: 2871
Joined: 3/1/2005
From: NE Ohio
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Christsgirl,
I am so sorry you are going through such a difficult time. There really isn't anything much worse than a miserable marriage. No one else can tell you when or if you should call it quits. That is between you and God.
I am praying for you.
_____________________________
This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 1:54:23 PM
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christsgirl
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quote:
Murder is not an unpardonable sin, either, but if I told you that I was hoping a person I did not like would break into my house so that I could shoot him, you'd be appalled.
This made me laugh. I'm sorry.
Jenny, you are correct - God did not make me marry this man. I understand this completely. That's why I said I'm mad he "allowed" me to. So, I did it, and yes, I'm paying for it. I kick myself EVERYday for the decision I made almost 3 years ago. I just wish someone - ANYONE - had stopped me. This marriage (and this man) consumes my mind daily. I believe life would be sooo much easier if I'd married someone else. I would still have struggles (because this marriage is by no means my only problem in life, but it's the biggest), but at least I'd have some that I can trust, to go through them with.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 2:00:00 PM
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Jenny-Fair
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From: WA
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It was ok to laugh, I was deliberately being ridiculous to point out that you are justifying your sinful desires.
We should be THANKFUL that God allows us free choice. He allowed you free choice when you chose to marry your spouse.
Honestly, you need to start looking at your marriage as a GIFT not a curse! Instead of kicking yourself every day, say to yourself, "Today I can bless my husband and obey God and rely on God for all of my needs."
You see, a problem that many people have is in thinking that they got married to make themselves happy. It doesn't work that way. And I don't think divorce will make you happy, either! But you have got to find a way to keep your eyes on the goal rather than on the problems. Not to ignore the problems, but to concentrate on the fact that in Christ, you have HOPE for your future.
Wouldn't you prefer improvement in the man and marriage you have now, rather than years of grief because you sinned and carried around all this anger?
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 2:07:53 PM
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christsgirl
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Jenny,
I think you're right - I don't feel that divorce would make me happy because it's still so unsettling with me. I never want to put my son through that either. BUT I do NOT want to live life as it is. I believe that God can do all things, but for some reason, He doesn't. For example, He has chosen to turn some marriages around, but others He doesn't. I try to have hope that things will get better someday, but then the thought enters my head that just maybe MY marriage is one of those that He won't turn around - He told me not to marry this man; I did anyways. So, now WHY would he fix it?
But to answer your question, YES, I'd prefer improvement in the man I married than to carry around grief for sinning - but only because I don't believe it would be right to remarry. And also because I guess I'm a scaredy cat - don't want to deal with divorce; I think it would feel terrible; I'd feel like a failure.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 2:11:30 PM
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laura...
Posts: 2871
Joined: 3/1/2005
From: NE Ohio
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quote:
This marriage (and this man) consumes my mind daily.
That is something you can call it quits to. Stop letting it consume you. Stop worrying about him and your marriage. You know you can't change him. Just put it all in God's hands and let it go. Do what you know is right every day. Stop trying to fix your husband and fix your marriage. Just live out your walk with Jesus.
_____________________________
This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 2:34:19 PM
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christsgirl
Posts: 45
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quote:
That is something you can call it quits to. Stop letting it consume you. Stop worrying about him and your marriage. You know you can't change him. Just put it all in God's hands and let it go. Do what you know is right every day. Stop trying to fix your husband and fix your marriage. Just live out your walk with Jesus.
I KNOW I need to do this - it's just a little easier said than done, that's all. Especially when some around you are so happy in their marriages. It becomes a longing.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 2:39:26 PM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6051
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From: WA
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quote:
He told me not to marry this man; I did anyways. So, now WHY would he fix it?
Have you asked for forgiveness for your disobedience? Because if so, then you have a nice, fresh page. God does not want you to commit one sin in an effort to 'fix' another, and he DOES want what is best for you! Think of your own child. If he fell out of a tree that you had told him not to climb and broke his arm in the process, would you not comfort him and take care of him while he healed? God loves you more than you love your son!
Don't you remember that God KNEW you would disobey? Do you really think that He is trying to punish you for marrying your husband? Because that is NOT the case, although if you have not repented, you need to address that.
You need to move forward from where you are. You need to be faithful to what you have and know now. I can't promise you that your husband will be saved and changed. I CAN tell you that you can have peace and contentment in the middle of strife. I can tell you that staying angry-at yourself, your husband and God-is not going to improve things for anyone and most certainly is not going to cause your husband to want what you have.
I hope you don't feel like I've been beating down on you. I am not trying to do so. Some of us do need sterner words than others, though--I am one of them. (((Hugs)))
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 2:51:10 PM
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christsgirl
Posts: 45
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Jenny,
I in NO WAY feel that you are beating me down. I'm one who needs sterner words too . And I appreciate all of your words of wisdom and your encouragement. The thing that you said that had the most profound impact was:
quote:
I can tell you that staying angry-at yourself, your husband and God-is not going to improve things for anyone and most certainly is not going to cause your husband to want what you have.
This is so true. I am miserable everyday, and of course my husband sees it. If I were him, I wouldn't want the "joy of christ" either if what I display is that "joy". So, I'm really going to make an effort to cheer up; stop looking so sad and mad; stop hating myself and him.
But how do I ignore his problems? What do I do when he doesn't respect me by coming home at a decent hour (which isn't often like it used to be, thank God)? Or when he tells me this week that he called into to work twice last week and just "hung out"? How do I respond (lovingly) to all these things?
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 3:02:11 PM
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laura...
Posts: 2871
Joined: 3/1/2005
From: NE Ohio
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quote:
But how do I ignore his problems? What do I do when he doesn't respect me by coming home at a decent hour (which isn't often like it used to be, thank God)? Or when he tells me this week that he called into to work twice last week and just "hung out"? How do I respond (lovingly) to all these things?
This is really hard to do but you just have to let it go and let those decisions be his problem. You have to choose not to let his choices upset you. Choose not to see his choices as disrespectful of you. He's an adult. Let him own his own decisions, problems and consequences.
_____________________________
This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 3:02:11 PM
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Jenny-Fair
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From: WA
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That is very hard. I think first I'd decide what really hurts and what I'm just plain mad about. If he does something that is hurtful, not merely selfish, then I think I'd just say, "I am hurt that you did such-and-so" and then leave it at that. No need to continue complaining or to punish him or to try and get him to admit that what he did was wrong (can you see I struggled with some of the same issues? LOL). If he's merely selfish, then I'd handle it much like I handle my kids. That is, reality is the best discipline. If dinner is at 6 and he doesn't get home until seven, then he gets to reheat his dinner and eat alone. But forgive him for it before he gets home, so that he doesn't come home to an angry wife.
On the other hand, I'd look for ways to bless him. Make something he likes, give him a hug for no reason, etc. AND, I would seriously be reading a lot of books. One in particular, and I might get ribbed for this suggestion, is Laura Schlessinger's Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands. Also The Five Love Languages. There are too many books to list, but I found those both helpful and practical.
I know it sounds unfair that you should put so much more into the marriage than he does...but it is your marriage, too, and by doing this, you are improving it and your chances that he will be convicted of his own sin (since he won't have yours to concentrate on!)
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 6:28:19 PM
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Zhi
Posts: 656
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quote:
Zhi, thanks for your post. I appreciate the things you said.
I don't feel that the christian life is supposed to be peaches and cream - I really don't. But is it supposed to be worse than the sinner's? I mean, my life is so miserable, I wish that God just didn't create me, honestly. I'm tired of the daily struggles with no break-throughs. I HAVE prayed for my marriage. I talk to God all the time, but He does not talk back. I pray for my marriage - stil no change. I work on myself - still I'm sad and lonely.
And as for counseling - I really am starting to despise the word. I have gone to counseling numerous times, although never faithfully. But the times I've gone, it has not helped me one bit. I feel like it's a waste of time and money that I don't have to waste. And I've gone to at least 5 different counselors over the years.
Honestly, I'm kinda mad at God for several reasons - for allowing me to marry this man, for condemning me to a life of misery (because He doesn't want me to remarry), and for not answering me when I reach out to Him. I'm at the point where I don't want to pray, don't wanna read my bible, go to church or anything because He doesn't answer and meet me where I am. I just can't reach him.
I totally understand. I was in the same boat. Didn't go to church (partially because the church we had been going to kind of imploded after the pastor got caught in adultery, but that's another story), didn't want to read my Bible, didn't want to pray other than to tell God how mad I was at Him.
The thing is that God is not mad at you. He's waiting patiently, looking at you with love, and He will be until you come around. For me, it was an entirely random tuning to a radio station to hear Lee Strobel speak on the Bible Answer Man at around 7:30pm at night on my way home after working late. I don't know what it will be for you, but I do have faith that He will eventually gently draw you back. How much you fight is going to pretty much be up to you. Admittedly I struggled pretty hard myself, but He's very convincing.
Yes, sometimes our lives will be worse than sinners'. The Bible practically guarantees it. But we have a hope that is greater than our struggles today. Take a look at this:
Luke 6:20 Looking at his disciples, he said: "Blessed are you who are poor, for yours is the kingdom of God. 21 Blessed are you who hunger now, for you will be satisfied. Blessed are you who weep now, for you will laugh. 22 Blessed are you when men hate you, when they exclude you and insult you and reject your name as evil, because of the Son of Man. 23 "Rejoice in that day and leap for joy, because great is your reward in heaven. For that is how their fathers treated the prophets. 24 "But woe to you who are rich, for you have already received your comfort. 25 Woe to you who are well fed now, for you will go hungry. Woe to you who laugh now, for you will mourn and weep. 26 Woe to you when all men speak well of you, for that is how their fathers treated the false prophets.
God may be asking you to suffer for Him now in your marriage. But, this isn't the end of it. Even if you suffer to the end of your days for your faith, choosing to obey God by honoring your marriage covenant, He will reward you. Hold onto that hope, as well as the hope that God will heal your marriage and let it be an example of His strength to His glory.
I guess I would encourage you to pray in a slightly different manner. Don't pray "Dear God, please fix my marriage and my scumbag of a husband" (Yeah, I know that prayer pretty well ;) ). Pray "God, help me to feel Your love, and help me to be a good wife, because I don't have the strength to do this on my own." And then try. I'm not saying it will be easy and I can pretty much guarantee you that it won't be quick, but if you're honest in asking that, God is faithful.
It may also make you feel better to volunteer. It helped me a lot to help others rather than dwelling on myself, and I didn't feel lonely when surrounded by people who were either fellow helpers, or who badly needed help.
If you don't have the money or time to go to counselling, or you don't feel like it's helping you, maybe you would do better reading. The books that really helped me were Lee Strobel's The Case for Faith, and once I had my head on straight, Dr. Laura's Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands. The Case for Faith helped me so much that I keep stacks of them on hand to give to people who are searching and hurting. I would be happy to send you a copy of that and The Case for Christ if you'd like, or you can find them in most Christian bookstores or on Amazon. It addresses things like when bad things happen to good people, and why life is hard.
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The optimist says the glass is half full. The pessimist says the glass is half empty. The engineer says the glass is twice as large as it needs to be.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/23/2007 6:41:01 PM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6051
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: WA
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quote:
The books that really helped me were Lee Strobel's The Case for Faith, and once I had my head on straight, Dr. Laura's Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands.
Oh, good, someone to hide behind when the tomatoes start flying! 
It's funny, 'cause I was not married when I read that book (actually, I'm still not remarried) and I was at a church event and set it down and left the room. When I came back the ladies there were trying to figure out to whom it belonged. I said it was mine and they gave me SUCH a look...so finally I said, "I'm studying for the final!" and they laughed and let me alone.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/24/2007 2:54:58 AM
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Hislittleone
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I just finished reading some of your old posts. It sounds like you are really in a stressful situation. If your dh is not a Christian then you cannot expect him to act like one. In a couple of marriage books I've read the authors say it's better to leave an unrepentant spouse before you become bitter with God. But they are talking about couples where both are Christian ( I think ). I would tell you that the porn is adutlery but he isn't a Christian so I don't know if it's the same. Also, you mentioned that you don't believe looking at porn is adulterous. My best advice to you is to try to rebuild your relationship with God. He hasn't let you down, your husband has. Plus you've made some poor choices. God won't magically make your husband turn into a Christian and good husband. Your husband has to CHOOSE GOD. Free will and all that.... Have you tried a separation? I would seriously consider that. Maybe it'll be the wake-up call that your husband needs. Essentially he gets to live in a home where he is taken care of financially, he is dishonest, looks at porn etc. but has no consequences. What happens to him when he is dishonest over and over or when he fails to get/keep a job? You might yell or argue and that is unpleasant but it's obviously not that unpleasant for him......it's not a deterrant for his bad behavior. Setting up boundaries can be done in a loving, firm way. You can still be a witness to him without letting him continue in these behaviors. What I'm trying to say is that being a witness to him doesn't mean that you have to let him treat you badly.
Most of all though, I am worried about your relationship with God.
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/24/2007 10:33:31 AM
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christianmom18
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Hi. I just wanted to say that is seems like you need to find out why you married him. Do you love him or are you in love with him? As a Christian you can not expect a non Christian to change in a day. You are supposed to live in a Christian manner and pray for him. REALLY PRAY FOR HIM! God answers prayers but only in his time! I think that if you are in love with your husband then you can work things out. You got married for a reason and you need to find that again. Stop looking for a way out and look for a way back in! Life is what you make of it. And if you are both willing to go for it then you can! I know that things he does or says may not be what you do but he will come around sometime. My husband lived in a unchristian like way when we were dating and at the beginning of our marriage. All you can do is pray for them. He is now a Deacon at our church and teaching the Adult Sunday School Class. I will be praying for you!
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Reva Holland
~*God Bless You*~
~*Phil. 4:13*~
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/24/2007 11:28:26 AM
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christsgirl
Posts: 45
Joined: 12/28/2005
Status: offline
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Thank you all for your replies and input. I will definitely take heed to some of the things you all are saying.
But while my situation is how it is, how do I keep myself and my thoughts focused on holy things and my eyes from looking at other men who are handsome and "appear" to be successful, and have themselves together - the things that my husband are not?
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RE: How did YOU know when to call it quits? - 10/24/2007 11:39:18 AM
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laura...
Posts: 2871
Joined: 3/1/2005
From: NE Ohio
Status: offline
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quote:
But while my situation is how it is, how do I keep myself and my thoughts focused on holy things and my eyes from looking at other men who are handsome and "appear" to be successful, and have themselves together - the things that my husband are not?
You make the choice not to look or focus on such things over and over and over and over again.
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This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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