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Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/22/2008 5:52:37 PM
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themoodyexperience
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Jason Upton Sings With An Angel?
Supposedly at the 5:00 mark, an angel starts singing with 'modern worship' leader Jason Upton.
Sounds like something off those 'Chant' cds from a few years back.
I've heard too many of these kinds of tapes before, just wanted to see what everyone thought of this one.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/22/2008 6:04:26 PM
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earthless
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Is Jason actually claiming it is an angel singing with him?
Correct me if I am wrong, isn't he associated with IHOP? Believe me, I am WAYYYYY out of it when it comes to the P&W scene.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/22/2008 6:17:24 PM
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1love1God1way
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
Is Jason actually claiming it is an angel singing with him?
To be fair to Jason, it wasn't him that first claimed it. It was his sound technicians who found a frequency that was not actually picked up by a mic, that they were aware of, and it was in perfect harmony with Jason and the music, despite there being no pickups on it.
I'm not a huge fan of Jason at times and the people he supports, but he did at least handle this situation well.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/22/2008 6:48:52 PM
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1love1God1way
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This is from the insert in the cd with this track:
quote:
There is no explanation for the last song, Fly, except that during the "do you see what I see" portion you will hear a soaring voice over the top of the other voices (6 minutes and 11 seconds into this section). At first we thought it was an ambient microphone picking up an overtone. During mixing all of the channels were searched and we found that this 'boys choir' type voice was not on any of the other microphones, but was bleeding through my own microphone ( which would make it impossible for it to be an overtone because it was not present on any of the other microphones).
If you listen carefully you will hear it again later in this section; it's not quite as clear because, unfortunately, my voice is prominent on that microphone.
Interestingly, a boy came up to me that night and told me that he saw an angel standing about fifteen feet behind me.and another one behind our drummer. At the time I doubted that; but after hearing the 'voice' alone during the mixing process with no other instruments around it, I do not doubt it anymore. It was very humbling and convicting for me to realize that I had not believed the boy.
I sometimes wrestle with why I so often disbelieve the supernatural (why would I first think it was something natural like an overtone, instead of believing it was an angel). The Bible tells us that we should not be surprised by angelic visitations; but I must admit, I was surprised!
Like I said, I don't really support Upton all that much (I have some of his music, it's not terrible, it's not great). He does support some bad ministries, and that's too bad.
But I think some of his listeners are cookier than he is, so I think it is best we just listen to what he has to say about his own music.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/22/2008 6:59:35 PM
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Kat_D
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You know, a couple of weeks ago, our worship leader was leading worship at our high school chapel when hundreds of kids spontaneously filed out of the auditorium to the fountain outside and started getting baptized. No prodding, no fanfare...just a true move of the Holy Spirit which was the result of pure worship with the focus on Jesus Christ. When I walked out of my office and saw what was happening I started to cry, because the presence of the Lord was so strong.
Now, that's what I'm talkin' about!!
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~Kat
"...And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes...no more death, sorrow, nor crying."
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/22/2008 7:17:11 PM
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1love1God1way
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It's definitely what I would rather see, too.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/22/2008 7:44:01 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Kat_D
You know, a couple of weeks ago, our worship leader was leading worship at our high school chapel when hundreds of kids spontaneously filed out of the auditorium to the fountain outside and started getting baptized. No prodding, no fanfare...just a true move of the Holy Spirit which was the result of pure worship with the focus on Jesus Christ. When I walked out of my office and saw what was happening I started to cry, because the presence of the Lord was so strong.
Now, that's what I'm talkin' about!!
Amen.
Our focus is to be on Jesus Christ. Not angels or anything else.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/22/2008 8:09:47 PM
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1love1God1way
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
Our focus is to be on Jesus Christ. Not angels or anything else.
Like said, Jason himself never focused on angels. At least not at that time.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/23/2008 6:25:28 PM
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Soxfan
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Jason Upton is associated with the heretical Latter Rain Movement. Most of his lyrics deal with that false doctrine
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"This would be the first step in apostasy; men first forget the true, and then adore the false.".......C.H. Spurgeon
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/23/2008 6:38:30 PM
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1love1God1way
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
Jason Upton is associated with the heretical Latter Rain Movement. Most of his lyrics deal with that false doctrine
Um. Yes, he IS associated with heretical teachers...
But I am not so sure about your second statement. I have a couple of his cd's, and I honestly can't say I have seen much of this in his music. I mean, it's possible I am just missing it. . .
I'm not saying he is the greatest lyric writer, but I just don't see much Latter Rain stuff in it . . .
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/25/2008 12:39:28 PM
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Kat_D
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
Most of his lyrics deal with that false doctrine
I mean, it's possible I am just missing it. . .
How about Trusting In Angels? I thought we were only supposed to trust in God.
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"...And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes...no more death, sorrow, nor crying."
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/25/2008 1:17:21 PM
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SirWintery
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
Jason Upton is associated with the heretical Latter Rain Movement. Most of his lyrics deal with that false doctrine
Um. Yes, he IS associated with heretical teachers...
But I am not so sure about your second statement. I have a couple of his cd's, and I honestly can't say I have seen much of this in his music. I mean, it's possible I am just missing it. . .
I'm not saying he is the greatest lyric writer, but I just don't see much Latter Rain stuff in it . . .
Ben, the one that was played ad nauseum on local Christian radio was the monotonous "Freedom", which contains such vague statements as "Pharoah let God's people go". This goes along with the general gist of messages about churches bound by "religious spirits" which is how all groups outside the NAR and related groups are viewed. It's really a backhand to say that more traditional worship is not in "freedom". The local church I formerly attended brought in Jason Upton when that song first came out and one of my friends told me "you've GOT to come hear Jason!" I didn't. I see him as flag-waver for Latter Rain and I remember him being advertised as a "major new prophetic voice in music" but it sounded like the same old Latter Rain message to me.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/25/2008 7:28:44 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
I see him as flag-waver for Latter Rain and I remember him being advertised as a "major new prophetic voice in music" but it sounded like the same old Latter Rain message to me.
Same here.. which is why I don't any mind to his stuff.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/26/2008 8:11:04 AM
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Soxfan
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
I see him as flag-waver for Latter Rain and I remember him being advertised as a "major new prophetic voice in music" but it sounded like the same old Latter Rain message to me.
Same here.. which is why I don't any mind to his stuff.
I've always tried to figure out what "prophetic worship" is.
He is essentially the musical arm of the NAR
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"This would be the first step in apostasy; men first forget the true, and then adore the false.".......C.H. Spurgeon
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/26/2008 8:24:00 PM
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chasbeck1
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
I see him as flag-waver for Latter Rain and I remember him being advertised as a "major new prophetic voice in music" but it sounded like the same old Latter Rain message to me.
Same here.. which is why I don't any mind to his stuff.
I've always tried to figure out what "prophetic worship" is.
He is essentially the musical arm of the NAR
This thread is quite interesting. I would like to add a few of my own observations. I am currently a member of the P&W team at my church.
Several years ago Jason Upton came to our church for a worship conference. The topic of the angel singing happened just a few weeks prior to him coming. Our worship team spent several evenings after the conference talking with Jason and His team. Much of the time we talked about the angel experience. We listed to the raw recordings and also the
the finished tracks. They showed us where they isolated each mic that was used at that session. They could not edit out the voice that came through behind Jason's. While I agree that we should not get caught up in the worship of angels, the Bible says in Hebrews 1: 14, "Are they not all ministering spirits sent forth to minister for those who will inherit salvation? I can tell you for a fact that during worship when the Spirit of God has shown up in a powerful way, people on our team as well as in the congregation have seen angels in the sanctuary. There is an interesting passage of scripture in Hebrews 13: 2, "Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some have unwittingly entertained angels. " Throughout scripture, both old and new testament, there are many accounts of angels appearing to individuals for various reasons. No
we do not woship angels, we Worship Christ but even Christ had angels minister to Him. As for Jason Upton, he is as genuine and sincere as any I have had the oppourtunity to worship with. Prophetic worship happens when one who's heart is pure before God, seeks to worship Him in Spirit and in truth. The Holy Spirit comes upon one who begins to prophecy a Word from the Lord through song. 1 Samuel, 10: 5-6.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/27/2008 12:02:31 AM
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bob97
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Did Daniel experience an angel or did Mary Magdalene and the other Mary see an angel and talk to him?
Bob
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/27/2008 1:41:54 AM
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1love1God1way
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quote:
ORIGINAL: wintery
quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
Jason Upton is associated with the heretical Latter Rain Movement. Most of his lyrics deal with that false doctrine
Um. Yes, he IS associated with heretical teachers...
But I am not so sure about your second statement. I have a couple of his cd's, and I honestly can't say I have seen much of this in his music. I mean, it's possible I am just missing it. . .
I'm not saying he is the greatest lyric writer, but I just don't see much Latter Rain stuff in it . . .
Ben, the one that was played ad nauseum on local Christian radio was the monotonous "Freedom", which contains such vague statements as "Pharoah let God's people go". This goes along with the general gist of messages about churches bound by "religious spirits" which is how all groups outside the NAR and related groups are viewed. It's really a backhand to say that more traditional worship is not in "freedom". The local church I formerly attended brought in Jason Upton when that song first came out and one of my friends told me "you've GOT to come hear Jason!" I didn't. I see him as flag-waver for Latter Rain and I remember him being advertised as a "major new prophetic voice in music" but it sounded like the same old Latter Rain message to me.
Like i said, I don't really listen to him. Years ago, I gave him a chance, but have since stopped.
The ministries he supported turned me off to him for good.
That being said, I still think most of the negativity that is shown comes from his loony followers and less from him. I think there tends to be more 'reading into the lyrics' to find stuff.
And I am really not trying to say those were angels on the album. I don't "trust the angels" (although I am not quite sure what that song actually means).
You guys know me, and have seen where I have posted. You know I strongly oppose the Latter Rain stuff.
He has issues, and I am not supporting him, only trying to give him a fair trial.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/27/2008 5:22:21 AM
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SirWintery
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
You guys know me, and have seen where I have posted. You know I strongly oppose the Latter Rain stuff.
He has issues, and I am not supporting him, only trying to give him a fair trial.
I know that, Ben, which is why I wanted to give you more than a one-line answer.
The obvious question is why an "angel" shows up where Upton is and sings on his recording--when we already know the group he's a part of. Why would an angel "endorse" the NAR crowd?
More than twenty years ago people were floating an "angelic recording" where a mysterious instrument played a note higher than the piano range...a cassette of this floated around the church I attended. As I recall somebody sang a practice session and nobody played piano but they "found" one on the recording. This idea pops up every few years.
I've runs sound on a full house band at church, in concerts and worked with audio for years including digital audio tools. When something is within _my_ power and resources to do, I just laugh at the angel talk.
While I am convinced that angels interact with us in ways to protect us, the idea of angels singing on recordings is just silly to me. It falls in the same category as bulk buys of cheap gems to throw on the floor and see who'll think they're from heaven, glitter that activates when you perspire to look like you're covered with gold dust from heaven, and closer to the duck down and feathers that you can buy online and drop in your church right when an "angel" is "seen".
Upton probably couldn't have paid for as much free advertising this angel talk is inadvertently getting for him.
The NAR bunch needs something like this to "redeem" the "angels" (that sounds so wrong!) after their recent drop in popularity due to you-know-who in Florida, I think. Angels have to get respectable again, LOL.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/27/2008 8:34:55 AM
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earthless
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Todd Bentley, "Focus on the angel!"
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/27/2008 10:30:59 AM
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themoodyexperience
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
Todd Bentley, "Focus on the angel!"
Speaking of which I just forced myself to sit through an episode of 'Extreme Prophetic' with Patricia King my parents had on DVD. It was all about angels. It made me sick to my stomach the angel worship that was going on. Apparently you can command angels at your will, and there are special prosperity angels waiting to release blessings and pixie dust. Well maybe not pixie dust. But unless I'm mistaken, the only one who even talked about commanding angels was Jesus. Correct me if I'm wrong. I know this is slightly off topic but it just reminded me of the angel worship sub-culture of the church today. And I also think that angels have better things to do than sing on Jason Upton CDs.
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/27/2008 11:03:08 AM
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Kat_D
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
Todd Bentley, "Focus on the angel!"
Upton also has a song called "Emma"...I was thinking it might be about Todd Bentley's demon angel, but he says it's about his daughter.
quote:
ORIGINAL: chasbeck1
Several years ago Jason Upton came to our church for a worship conference. The topic of the angel singing happened just a few weeks prior to him coming. Our worship team spent several evenings after the conference talking with Jason and His team. Much of the time we talked about the angel experience.
And herein lies the BIG problem. The majority of your time together was spent discussing "the angel experience."
Question: Why would the Lord Jesus Christ, send an angel to Christians who are supposed to be worshiping Him and take all the focus off of Himself and put on this other creature?
18 "Let no one cheat you of your reward, taking delight in false humility and worship of angels..."-Colossians 2
Answer: He wouldn't.
21 "because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man--and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things. 24 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, 25 who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen." -Romans 1
_____________________________
~Kat
"...And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes...no more death, sorrow, nor crying."
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RE: Jason Upton Singing With An Angel? - 11/27/2008 6:09:12 PM
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chasbeck1
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Jason was singing about his daughter, Emma. I understand your point that we should not get caught up in false worship of angels. I agree. How do you account then for all the places in scripture where angels, (who are messesgers from God) have appeared with a message or instructions for a certain purpose. We have the angel Gabriel appearing to Mary, telling her that she will bear a son who will be the savior of the world. An angel appeared to Zechariah, the father of John the Baptist. An angel appeared to Joseph, Mary' husband to be. Angels came and ministered to Jesus after He endured the 40 days in the wilderness. No, angels are not to be worshiped but they have had their place through out biblical history, because they all have a part in God's plan. When Jesus Christ is worshiped in spirit and in truth, angels often accompany the presence of God. I worship the Lord Jesus Christ not angels. But I have also experienced what I call a visitaion, during times of deep worship. I play guitar on the worship team, and there have been times when it felt like some one other than myself was playing my guitar. Literally like some one or something else was moving my hands. Was it an angel, I can't really say. But it was one of the most awesome worship times I have ever experienced. I'm not here to question what others experience during worship, I just know what I have experienced. If you have the faith to believe that all things are possible with God, then who know what you might see.
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going for the NAR crowd he associates with. 