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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 9/28/2008 4:49:55 PM
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pbaribeault
Posts: 1026
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It's not your fault. He does love you. You may not 'get along' but your constant love (and expectations) are a pillar of his life. He doesn't seem to think his dad is quite so safe or reliable.
Being a teen hurts... School sucks, especially when you're in trouble... Socializing is less fun than spending the night in the lion's den... And split-parents are a deep pain and broken foundation in the life of a child or, in this case, a young man. (It's not about the phone.)
To some degree it's natural to think, "I just can't deal with this." and then to go on to thinking about exactly how one would not have to deal with it, which means that (alongside other possibilities) suicide is something many frustrated, overwhelmed and somewhat hopeless teens think about.
There's thinking about it, as an idea, as just one of those things that is 'out there' and you just think about it. Then there's thinking about it as in thinking about doing it, as in seriously thinking that this might be a solution for you.
In telling this to you, I don't think it is an attempt to cause guilt in you. It's not about you. He's probably not thinking about how you might feel at all. He's letting you into his world to see if you have anything to offer him. He's feeling hopeless, but maybe you can help him.
First, you need to do some reading. Get a few good books on understanding teens and try to wade into them. I'm not an expert, and you need more than the general wisdom of the internet public.
But, as far as general wisdom,
(1) I'd suggest that he needs an activity, goal, group or self-identification that helps him get beyond thinking about the daily stupid absurdity of school. Does he imagine going into business one day? Is he interested in politics? Can you spark his interest in missions? Humanitarian work? Military? Whatever this is, give it your full backing and encourage him to latch on to it, "I'm not just a school kid. I'm going to do something worthwhile once I'm through this school stuff that I need to get out of the way first."
(2) Lighten the home-load. Give the ferrets to somebody who really will get a kick out of them. Have less stuff in his room. Take turns on the grass.
(3) Do not tolerate rudeness. Tell him firmly that you are on his side and want him to be one of the grown ups in your home, but that what he says effects how you feel about him. If he wants you to be into being less parent-ish and more making a home together-ish, he might want to watch his words. Those words make you want to punish him like a 6 year old.
(4) Add some fun, some happy times, some get-out-of-town and eat ice cream without talking about the price... times with no expectations (except human courtesy of course). These build both relationships and happiness -- which is really important right now.
I hope this helps.
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 9/29/2008 10:38:42 AM
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Rebecca1965
Posts: 21
Joined: 9/28/2008
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This is what I have been told that he trust me... but it is hard to handle when he can be so contrary about every suggestion I make.. I want to share with him and encourage him but it is like he tells me you just do not uderstand.... it is not like that .... blah blah blah.... so is he asking me for advice? or just sounding off it is so hard to tell sometimes .... I know the advice I give him will work but he fights it tooth and nail.....
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 9/29/2008 12:21:37 PM
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truthrevealed
Posts: 312
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Are you aware of any type of abuse your child my have suffered or been exposed to? If he used the talk of suicide as a means of manipulation that's one thing(although out of all things to use to get your way, threats of suicide is waaaay over the top)but it seems as if he's harboring deep seated pain. Perhaps the divorce or present relationship between parents? I'd seek God for answers about what is going on with your son......and expect Him to reveal it to you!
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 9/29/2008 1:54:56 PM
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laura...
Posts: 2861
Joined: 3/1/2005
From: NE Ohio
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quote:
At the time I said something about calling his dad my son begged me not too and said he would not be able to go thru with it anyway...
So what does this mean is it me ....
It means that he needs help. Always take threats of suicide seriously.
Antagonism toward a parent and the rules of the home are pretty standard for teens his age. However, talk of suicide and his statement that he has been unhappy for the past 5 years must be taken seriously. He may be suffering from clinical depression.
_____________________________
This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 9/29/2008 2:29:08 PM
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Rebecca1965
Posts: 21
Joined: 9/28/2008
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There was a time he stayed with a sitter that I was uncomfortable with and as soon as I could removed him from the situation... I really could not put my finger on it but was not happy with the situation.... this was while I was still married to his dad.... His dad loves him very much and does so much for him.... but allows him to do little for himself.... so when I have expectations of him he balks.... and acts as though I were asking him to walk thru the dark in the middle of the night to town...
His dad is very manipulating ..... he used to cry and tell him how much he would miss him when we would make the exchange.... I pulled him aside and told him that was so selfish of him.... this was about our son not my exhusbands feeling.... being dumped on our son between visits...... He said he would try to do better.... I havent seen anything like that for a while .... so maybe our son feels torn.....and it comes up more when he does not get his way.... but he does not understand that himself and does not know what to do with it .... He is treated like a king in one situation and less than one in the other.... Although I believe we both spoil him.... being an only child .... but in different ways.
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 9/29/2008 11:17:01 PM
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jaimestarcross
Posts: 785
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Your son is dealing with something.
I'm thinking he's being "primed" by his dad to cause these upsets at home - his upsets are aimed at you... things are your fault - he's embarrassed by you (what does that mean?)
I see you mentioned his dad is manipulative...hmmm!
I strongly urge getting into counseling ASAP.
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 9/30/2008 9:41:14 AM
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buckifn
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Suicide threats are a cry for help. Please go with this young man for family counseling asap. He is crying out the only way he knows how and telling you of his inability to cope with the things happening in his life.
How old was he when you and his father divorced and did he have any counseling to get through that process?
Thank God he has enough trust in you to share a little bit of his need for help. Please get it for him.
there is a link here that may help
http://www.metanoia.org/suicide/whattodo.htm
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 10/1/2008 9:48:23 PM
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Rebecca1965
Posts: 21
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Thanks everyone for the advice... it has really helped me cope.... I have went to some of the web pages and gotten some useful information.... WE are going to see the Phycologist Oct 6th ... His dad is going with us.... I PRAY that things will start going in the right direction.... I know that it will still be difficult ... but hopefully we can start seeing the light at the end of the tunnel .... I am still confused at how much to punish him he goes to get his drivers license tomorrow and hopefully all will go well....
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 10/8/2008 10:54:04 AM
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pbaribeault
Posts: 1026
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He's not "off base". He was asked to tell what he thinks and feels, so he did. He told what's inside his head. He was not asked to give an accurate account of family life that week. It's about his perceptions. You need to understand that regardless of how you see real life, his feelings are reality to him. It was kind of him to let you know.
'Don't treat me like a kid' is about the voice and words you use when you speak to him.
Try this: Before any sentence, think, "If I had an adult female roommate instead of a son, how would I bring this issue up with her?"
'Do not try to manipulate or bribe me' is about how you try to get stuff done or modify his behaviour. Using rewards and punishments at his age is demeaning to him.
Try this: move into a 'coaching' role where you advise and strongly encourage good behaviour, but you don't pretend you can make him do anything. Definitely don't do more than a one-time simple offer to pay him (if it's appropriate) and all consequences should be closely tied to the wrongdoing. (And any 'wrongdoing' should be a violation of a clear responsibility, not just something that you don't like.)
'Do not lie to me' is about outright lying, shading the truth, as well as promise keeping and general dependability and integrity.
Try this: ask God to make you very sensitive in your heart to the slightest 'dishonesty' that you might commit (even by mistake). Be careful what you say 'OK' to -- because that's your word and it has to be kept. Teens are very sensitive to this kind of thing.
'Act your age' is about being somebody that he can trust to be the adult in a situation.
Try this: evaluate your clothes (that you wear in public) and your public persona. Are you still trying to act like a 'young, fun, available single woman? If so, save this for your own time. When you share public space with him, and in your home, act like a boring grown up parent figure that can be depended on. This also might mean, especially in the home, that you need to keep your emotions either in-check or private from him. He is your son, not your buddy, and having a mom that can break down in tears or fly off the handle is just not a 'safe' home.
'Be there when I need you I will let you know' is about your role as confidante.
Try this: when you notice he is emotional, calmly say, "You seem a bit <emotion>, if it's worth chatting about, I've got time to be a listening ear for you." Then leave the topic, but continue to hang around or pop in on him in case he wants to take you up on the offer.
'Don't make fun of me' is about your gentle poking-fun to unwind his stress.
Try this: Quit it! Try the above "You seem a bit stressed..." sentence instead, or offer a distraction.
'Don't criticize my way of doing things' 'usually I ask if i need help' and 'the best way to learn is thru trial and error' are all about the learning process.
Try this: he clearly prefers trying things his own way and even getting them wrong, rather than listening to instructions or doing something just because that's the way he's been told to do it. This is the great strength of an innovator... so let him do it. Some things will take longer, and occasionally something will get broken, but you can handle that. Let him try his own ways, and you might be surprised. (Not that you can't give occasional warnings, but if you keep them occasional, he is more likely to take you seriously.)
'Keep the house clean' is about the trade-off relationship between parents and kids.
Try this: The best way to teach him responsibility is to do it yourself and have him watch. Besides that, coming home to a clean home feels secure, safe, calm and loving. This is an important act of love and duty that you can do for your son.
'Realize I don't like all the food u do' is easy
Try this: Say, "I realize you don't like this meal, but I do, and that's the way it works when 2 people live together. Other times I make stuff I don't like so that you can have something you enjoy a lot. It's just taking turns."
'Try to make us all happy' is the only unreasonable thing on the list.
Try this: it might help if you were more open in showing empathy (a sense of feeling-alongside people who feel badly) and interest (asking things like 'How would you feel if..." and "How do you feel about...") in others happiness.
'Stop treating me like a pest' is about your face, tone of voice and attitude.
Try this: everyone knows it's not easy to live with a teen, but try not to let him know that. Find some friends to vent to, but otherwise try to focus on how delightful it is to see him stretching into an adult and how proud you are to see what kinds of things he is accomplishing through his development.
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 10/8/2008 3:30:48 PM
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laura...
Posts: 2861
Joined: 3/1/2005
From: NE Ohio
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Rebecca1965
 This is very insightful...
The act my age thing is the only thing I can't see.... it is not about dress. It is more about me being friendly to everyone... at the grocery store if I stop to speak to someone ( a female friend) and we get to laughing he assumes I am acting like a child... he will grab my arm in the middle of the conversation and pull me away rudely and say be quite and come on... He has taken things out of my buggy and put them back on the shelf b/c they were not on the list... we are not wealthy but not in poverty either.... but his dad is very conservative... and is a strong influence on him for that .... except for things he wants ... then it is ok...
We went to the fair the other night and I stopped to fill out a drawing for a canoe.... He got so mad and said he was leaving .... and walked off ... He found me 15-20 min later ..and said what stupid thing did I buy... I told him I did not buy anything and he said he was ready to go.... I thought to myself that the only stupid thing I bought was a ticket for him to get in...
In the above statement it is hard not to treat him like a pest.... So hard ... I do love him but this is most likely why he does not have any friends....
At a football game I will bring my crocheting and he will tell me that is not appropriate... or if I don't bring something else I may get into the game and cheer with the crowd.... He tells me to stop... I would leave him there but ... it is a 30 mile ride to town and home so 60 miles just for him to go to a ball game that if I don't stay with him he doesn't want to go...
The other night he raised his hand and hit me... b/c he dropped his chopped steak on the floor and I was picking up to give it to the dog... He hit me and said the dogs aren't going to get table scraps... I looked at him and said Do Not Hit me.... looked him in the eye and continued... That really frightened me .... He did not hit me hard but just the fact that he would startled me...
quote:
Act my age... you are not a kid anymore and man up to it. There has to be a parent in this house if you act like a baby step up to that role.
He's right. You need to act like the parent. Of course, he's not going to like you doing so. But, right now he is parenting you. Put a stop to it. Do not tolerate him grabbing your arm, raising a hand to you, hitting you no matter how lightly, correcting you, etc. He is out of control because you have not set any personal boundaries with him. If you don't stop this now he will only escalate his behavior. This is all about control...who has it. It's certainly not you, the parent.
_____________________________
This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 10/8/2008 4:11:44 PM
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pbaribeault
Posts: 1026
Joined: 4/29/2005
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Your son is in need of some professional intervention. As his mom, the best thing you can do is (1) make sure he gets it (2) see that you understand it well enough to support the changes that he & the psychologist are trying to make (3) make sure that the psychologist has enough information about these situations that he can help effectively.
His attitude towards you is completely inappropriate... but if he becomes less angry, judgmental and impatient, that might improve.
Towards that end, you should put all your effort into setting a good example in those areas. This gives you the "moral high ground" that leaves him feeling like you are calm and mature, and his emotions are running his life. This might give him incentive to change, as well as it would increase his respect for you as a person.
So, especially refrain from anger, physical aggression, judgmental comments, name calling and impatience.
Also, try to de-stress his life...
Grocery shop alone. Consider it your job to manage the budget, make the list, purchase and prepare food. Do not involve him in this volatile process. He should not be made aware of your financial situation, nor should he have a say-so in what you choose to buy. (Also, if you shop alone, and you run into a friend, you can chat without wasting his time... the time you were already wasting by having him come shopping with you.)
If the situation happens again, you might consider being courteous enough to ask him if he minds waiting while you chat, or perhaps you could make a date to see your friend shortly. However, if he does become impatient and begins grabbing and insulting you, you need to put your foot down. "I understand that you are feeling impatient, but that arm belongs to me, and I can waste my time if I want to. If you need to find something else to do, please feel free. I expect to take another 5 minutes with this conversation."
The canoe draw at the fair also sounds like impatience is at the heart of it. If you intend to do fun things like filling out draw forms, don't expect your son to wait around like a shadow. It's not his thing. It would have been better to part ways in a friendly manner much earlier in the day, and meet up again for things you both enjoy, after having enjoyed your individual things. BUT, in the case that he spoke to you in such a nasty way, you can't stand for that. Face him calmly and say, "That question is an insult and I will not tolerate it. Your insults hurt and upset me, and you owe me an apology." Then you figure out a real consiquence, such as, "If you choose not to apologize, be aware that an apology is worth $20, which I will be deducting from your allowance next week."
On the other hand, your football game situation tells me that you either have very little self control, or you just don't think it is worth controlling your behaviour at the game for his sake. It's really quite easy to choose not to crochet, and also to choose not to cheer with ostentatious enthusiasm. Keep a grip on yourself if you want to show your love and support to your son. (Is he a player or a spectator? Does he really want to go? Does he really want you to go? Why is it important that you be there?)
But the last is most significant.
NOBODY HITS YOU.
He does not make household rules (about what the dogs eat) and he does not enforce them, either with words or hands. This incident is critical, yet it sounds like you only spoke to him about it in the moment. Other than that, you should have made it very clear through real consequences. If it's only been a day or two you still might be able to make this stick. (If not, consider these ideas for future infractions.)
"Son, the other day you made a really stupid decision. You decided to hit me because you were angry about the steak and the dogs. I refuse to share a home with anybody who thinks that kind of thing is OK. You are not my husband, and you are not the man of this house. Even if you were, I would not choose to live with an abusive husband. And I will not raise you to think abuse is OK. How are you going to show me that you know that hitting other people is wrong?"
An apology is not enough. He needs to make amends in some physical, practical way, plus he needs to prove that he understands what abuse is and what it does to people. This adds up to something like an internet research project on abuse, plus some extra chores, and a written letter of apology with a pledge to find other ways to express his anger, and a plan to find other ways to express his anger, with real steps taken along that plan.
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RE: My relationship with my son is not good - 10/14/2008 3:37:47 PM
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pbaribeault
Posts: 1026
Joined: 4/29/2005
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I'm really happy to see you behaving more firmly with him, having limits and real rules rather than just reactions. "No hitting" is a very important rule, but is someone working with him to find a better way to express his anger and/or how to ask people to do something his way?
If the dog is relationally 'his' that doesn't mean he makes household rules, but it might mean that he can say, "Mom, don't. I think it's really unhealthy and bad for the dog to give him scraps. Please don't." If he is speaking instead of hitting, you can for sure let him have his own way about things like the dog's eating habits.
He can't 'boss' you, but if he asks you like an adult there is no reason for you to maintain rigid control in situations that he clearly cares a lot about. Teach him that speaking to you appropriately actually is a tactic that works for him getting his own way.
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Well where do I begin... it seems like ever since my son turned 13 our relationship has taken a hard turn for the worst... he is going to turn 16 in a couple of days and last week he admitted after a punishment ( taken his phone away) that he thought about killing himself... I could not believe that it was over the phone he commenced to tell me it was all about me.... how embarresed he was of me... and what an awful day he had.. I ask him to tell me about it and in sobs he told me how he woke up late and made his dad late for work ( we are divorced + 12 years) he goes to his dads every Wednesday and every other weekend... anyway he said it made his dad sad and he had to grab a shirt that was too small and got sent to the office for having his shirt tail out .... he is very easily embarressed and that was an awful expience for him ... then they got checked and he had his cell phone which is supposed to be put in a basket at the beginning of each class... so he had to go back to the office to talk to the head master.... and he can not bring his phone back to school for 30 days.... so I told him I would keep his phone ..... I guess he felt like that was too much ... and left ... he came back an hour later with the statement of thinking about killing himself that he has not been happy for 5 years .... I had no idea where this is coming from .... I called the phsycologist that has given him a social anxeity test and told him about the thoughts my son was having ..... I also called his dad .... He said that our son did not act like that around him and he did not see it... 
I have talked to him about living with his dad. He doesn't want to ..... I just do not understand
My husband my sons step dad is going to be home for the next 3months from working shift work... I sat down and talked to him about what I needed. He has rarely if ever gotten involved with punshishment. He was willing to sit and support me while I had my son fill out a Teen Driving Contract (suggested by the Phycologist) and a house rule list. My husband had been made aware of the situation... My son did not want to sit and read the contract out loud which is recommended... My husband firmly said b/c that is what we are going to do. Reluctenly he came and sat on the couch and read off the list. Then he said the car was his car and my husband said no it is our car and you get to use it. The house rules were no hitting. 1st occurance a written apology .... 2nd written apology and no allowance for a month. 3rd he moves out... my son started saying it was just a tap... and it was his dog ... I explained to him who fed the dog and took the dog to the vet and who made the house rules. After everything was signed he went to his room and did not speak to me the rest of the afternoon... It was soooo hard not to go and ask are u ok? I knew he would see that as weakness and not concern... so I talked to my husband about it to get some relief.... and left everything on his terms.... b/f it was done I explained that I loved him and he does need a parent and that is what I am that his well being is more important than being his friend. I told him although I love him and it would hurt that he was 16 and could live where he wanted.. that was his decision.... and that he had the freedom to make that choice... But the rules stand.