RE: Why do we need a Pope? (Full Version)

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meep meep -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/15/2005 2:02:53 PM)

Dear Betty:

Thank you so much for your clear exposition of the office of Pope.

There is ample scriptural support if one looks at scripture honestly and in context.

Yet, even if one ignores scripture and looks at the practice and development of Church and doctrine the emergent authority and function of the Pope become clearly evident - these historical supports, I might add, are precisely those we often ("we" meaning all Christians) use to support the validity of the scriptures as the Word of God and the message of Christ.

Thank you, TimL, GoodME, and other Catholics I have not as yet met, for your fine answers, and I especially thank my Protestant brethren for your very good and respectful questions.

I look forward to deeper understanding and dialogue with each of you.

Blessings in Christ,

Meep meep

P.S.

Where is Iakavos?



GoodME -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/15/2005 2:19:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bettyg51
Nobody ever told you what the pope's job is?

It shall be great having Betty here .......

Great post.



sdaw -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/16/2005 8:44:54 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe

Somebody has to be the anti-Christ...


John


Dear John,

It's Prince Charles. See my post in "Prophecy"

Eternal rest grant onto him, O Lord!



Les -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/17/2005 3:31:35 PM)

Hi there, I would like to ask a question re the appointment of a Pope.

I was reading a post yesterday in a Catholic site .... the question was asked of him.. "what if a Pope was elected to office and turned out to be corrupt or just plain bad?

The answer was given by an apologist there that there was no way that a Pope can be removed from office once he has been appointed, that he is the top and that no one can unappoint him, no matter how bad he may turn out.

Is this true? that once he is Pope, he literally cannot be directed or removed by man or in anyway, no matter what he may say or do?

Thanks for the chance to discuss this and God Bless

Les



GoodME -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/17/2005 3:53:44 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Les

Hi there, I would like to ask a question re the appointment of a Pope.

I was reading a post yesterday in a Catholic site .... the question was asked of him.. "what if a Pope was elected to office and turned out to be corrupt or just plain bad?

The answer was given by an apologist there that there was no way that a Pope can be removed from office once he has been appointed, that he is the top and that no one can unappoint him, no matter how bad he may turn out.

Is this true? that once he is Pope, he literally cannot be directed or removed by man or in anyway, no matter what he may say or do?

I would share your concern if not for "Canon" which defines procedure, protocol, bounds of authority, etc. and the intense scrutiny that one must endure even in the office of Cardinal.

We Catholics have faith that the process that has selected the Pope for 1,700 years has been led and guided by the Holy Spirit. On a more practical note, the Cardinals have a lot vested in getting the selection right. In this day and age, one does not become a Cardinal without a ot of public record and scrutiny on which to stand.

And a Cardinal is who is eligible to be Pope.

During the Pope's funeral - one of the men you saw standing there in red, assisting in presiding over the funeral - will be the next Pope. And all of these men are well known to each other and fairly well known to Catholics world-wide (there are only 107 of them).

The scenario you described would have to be a deception of the order of magnitude as to fool many, many, many Faithful. We all should be concerned - should this happen.

I am almost certain that it can't - in this day and age of freedom of the press.



Les -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/17/2005 4:28:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GoodME

quote:

ORIGINAL: Les

Hi there, I would like to ask a question re the appointment of a Pope.

I was reading a post yesterday in a Catholic site .... the question was asked of him.. "what if a Pope was elected to office and turned out to be corrupt or just plain bad?

The answer was given by an apologist there that there was no way that a Pope can be removed from office once he has been appointed, that he is the top and that no one can unappoint him, no matter how bad he may turn out.

Is this true? that once he is Pope, he literally cannot be directed or removed by man or in anyway, no matter what he may say or do?

quote:

The scenario you described would have to be a deception of the order of magnitude as to fool many, many, many Faithful. We all should be concerned - should this happen.

I am almost certain that it can't - in this day and age of freedom of the press.


But it is still possible??? and he could not be removed?

And one more question.... I saw it said also that any ordained Catholic can be elected to the office not just a cardinal....correct?

Thank you so much for your patience and your reponses.

God Bless

Les



GoodME -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/17/2005 4:50:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Les
But it is still possible??? and he could not be removed? In theory - I suppose it is. But to believe this is to have no Faith, isn't it?

And one more question.... I saw it said also that any ordained Catholic can be elected to the office not just a cardinal....correct? This may also be true - I'm not sure. But the Cardinals are the only ones who vote and my money is on it being someone with whom they are all very, very familiar with.

Thank you so much for your patience and your reponses. Thanks for your questions. Keep 'em coming, if you have them.



Ezra -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/17/2005 5:00:38 PM)

quote:

Where is Iakavos?


With Abraham and Isaac.



ChesterDash -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/17/2005 10:57:54 PM)

We don't need a pope, period.



GoodME -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 10:11:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChesterDash
We don't need a pope, period.

For all of Faith, there is one who serves as "Pope", or the equivalent of this office. It just comes down to whether this is "self", "pastor", "council of elders", or...well...the Pope himself.

I noted the depth and breadth of the points in your defense of your position above. Very convincing.



catherwood -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 10:37:55 AM)

We don't need a Pope. [&:]

God lead and bless and keep in Christ,
Catherwood



meep meep -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 11:13:33 AM)

Who is "we"?

...and would you please cite book, chapter and verse of specific scripture that explicitly states "we" are prohibited or have no need of a pope?

you have made an "authoritative" pronouncement, what is your basis?

In anticipation of your well reasoned, textually supported and illuminating reply [8|]

Meep meep



sdaw -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 12:25:24 PM)

As Brother Dave used to say, "Let them who don't want none, not get any. It is not a punishment, but their reward."

Come Holy Spirit!



catherwood -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 12:49:02 PM)

Well, Meep meep, I will try to say something. [8|]

By 'we' I mean everyone - believer and unbeliever. The term 'Pope' is a little more complicated. Technically speaking, if you adhere strictly to Catholic teaching, the Pope is the representative of Christ on earth. In other words, what the Pope says in his official office as Pope is equal in authority to what Christ would say. In other words, what the Pope says is equal to the word of God. I and we don't need another Pope because people are made 'complete in Christ', Col. 2.10. We don't need another Christ. No one does. Many Catholics aren't really 'Catholic' on this point. You will hear Catholics disagree with the Pope on all kinds of issues. Technically, if they are good Catholics, they can't do this. The Pope's edicts and words while he functions in his office as Pope are equal in authority to Christ's. He is Christ's official representative on earth. This is a false teaching. You won't find it anywhere in Scripture. [:(]

Hope this is helpful. [:)]

God bless, keep and lead you in Christ,
Catherwood



GoodME -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 1:39:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: catherwood
By 'we' I mean everyone - believer and unbeliever. The term 'Pope' is a little more complicated. Technically speaking, if you adhere strictly to Catholic teaching, the Pope is the representative of Christ on earth. In other words, what the Pope says in his official office as Pope is equal in authority to what Christ would say. In other words, what the Pope says is equal to the word of God. I and we don't need another Pope because people are made 'complete in Christ', Col. 2.10. We don't need another Christ. No one does. Many Catholics aren't really 'Catholic' on this point. You will hear Catholics disagree with the Pope on all kinds of issues. Technically, if they are good Catholics, they can't do this. The Pope's edicts and words while he functions in his office as Pope are equal in authority to Christ's. He is Christ's official representative on earth. This is a false teaching. You won't find it anywhere in Scripture.

I think it might be worthwhile for you to go back to previous posts in this thread (if you have time/interest) and see what the Pope is and what he does for Catholics.

What you are suggesting in my reading of your post is that we are all our own Pope. In which case I say that I am not qualified for this job - the discernment and definition of Faith and its practice as instructed and exampled by Jesus to his Apostles for their conveyance and teaching to us.

Remember - we have no direct wuotes from Jesus - only the recollections of His followers some 20 to 60 years after-the-fact. No doubt inspired by the Holy Spirit, but we only know Jesus through an Apostle - not "in person" the way they did. Catholics simply believe that this witness and office and role has been deposited in Church, of which the Pope is the head of.

What I hear you saying is "baloney". Any person that can pick up a KJV and read may properly discern and define the Faith lying therein. As evidence of the incorrectness of this assumption, I simply point to the vast array of teachings and meanings that seem to exist via "Tom, Joe and Harry" discerning anything they want.

If all these diverging discernments are "inspired" or "guided", then the guide sure has a great sense of humor.



Lurker -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 2:28:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: catherwood
By 'we' I mean everyone - believer and unbeliever. The term 'Pope' is a little more complicated. Technically speaking, if you adhere strictly to Catholic teaching, the Pope is the representative of Christ on earth.


Yes and no. It's a bit more complicated than that. But the office of the Pope was established by Our Blessed Lord Jesus as documented in Matthew 16:18 when He announced that Peter was to be the Rock.


quote:

In other words, what the Pope says in his official office as Pope is equal in authority to what Christ would say. In other words, what the Pope says is equal to the word of God.


Well... Not exactly. The Apostle Peter (the first pope) was given the keys to the kingdom of Heaven, and the authority to bind and loose. (Matthew 16:18-20)

So, when the Pope is utilizing His authority as given to him by the Lord Jesus then we can say with confidence that it is equal in authority to Christ's words since Our Blessed Lord Jesus gave them that authority. Now to clarify though, when would this apply? Generally it applies only when the pope is speaking "Ex Cathedra", meaning "from the chair"
Essentially the pope has to explicitly say that he's utilizing the authority vested in him by the Lord.


quote:

I and we don't need another Pope because people are made 'complete in Christ', Col. 2.10. We don't need another Christ. No one does. Many Catholics aren't really 'Catholic' on this point. You will hear Catholics disagree with the Pope on all kinds of issues. Technically, if they are good Catholics, they can't do this. The Pope's edicts and words while he functions in his office as Pope are equal in authority to Christ's. He is Christ's official representative on earth.


Well, actually I can disagree with the pope on all sorts of issues and still be a good Catholic. I might disagree with him regarding musical tastes, or food preferences. I might even disagree with him on theological issues. But if he speaks on an issues whilst utilizing the authority vested in him by the Blessed Lord, I certainly will rethink my position! And even if I don't agree with him on other issues, I'm trying to at least research the reasons behind his viewpoint and re-evaluating my own views.

quote:

This is a false teaching. You won't find it anywhere in Scripture. [:(]


I found it in Matthew 16:15-19 myself. That's the most obvious place in scriptures for it. I'm sure GoodMe, or Bettyg51, or another good Catholic can point out more. :)

quote:


Hope this is helpful. [:)]

God bless, keep and lead you in Christ,
Catherwood


It explained your point of view pretty nicely, although I obviously diagree with you. :) Still, it's always good to talk about these things and pray about them. Makes me really research the hows and whys of what I believe.

Peace be with you!

-Lurker



beachpjs -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 2:30:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GoodME

[
I noted the depth and breadth of the points in your defense of your position above. Very convincing.



Thats not very nice.
If it said specifically in the bible that we need a pope, then I would agree that we need one. Since it does not, then we don't.



catherwood -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 2:46:41 PM)

Thanks Lurker for your reply. [:)] I understand what you mean by ex cathedra - yeah - no one in Scripture is given that type of authority except Christ. Any authority that a church leader has is a derived authority. In other words, they only have authority as long as they are teaching in line with what Scripture has already laid down as truth. I actually typed up a long exposition from a commentary I have on the Matthew 16.18-20, etc., verses that you bring up. I typed it up and then lost it because when I pressed the ok button I had lost my connection. Those Matthew verses are not teaching 'Apostolic Succession'. The church isn't built on Peter and his successors. The church is built on Christ and the teaching of the apostles, not the apostles themselves and their successors. I would encourage you to get John MacArthur's commentary on Matthew chapter 16 -23. He goes into this. If Peter and his papal successors are the foundation on which the church is built then why does Christ also teach that the greatest in the kingdom of heaven is someone who is like a little child in humility? Why didn't he say that Peter was the greatest? Matthew 16 doesn't teach that the Pope has authority equal to Christ, even, ex cathedra. There are two different forms of the Greek word for rock being used in that passage in Matthew 16.18-20. The Greek word for Peter is a different form of the Greek word in 'upon this rock'. One is a little rock (Peter), one is for a mountainous rock ('Upon this rock') - i.e. - a rock that is a mountain. [8D] I don't mean to offend, it's just that we must pursue being true to the word of God.

God bless and lead and keep you in the Christ,
Catherwood



Lurker -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 3:18:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: catherwood

Thanks Lurker for your reply. [:)]


Oh you're most welcome. :D

quote:


I understand what you mean by ex cathedra - yeah - no one in Scripture is given that type of authority except Christ. Any authority that a church leader has is a derived authority. In other words, they only have authority as long as they are teaching in line with what Scripture has already laid down as truth. I actually typed up a long exposition from a commentary I have on the Matthew 16.18-20, etc., verses that you bring up. I typed it up and then lost it because when I pressed the ok button I had lost my connection.


D'oh! I hate it when things like that happen to me. It's never fun. I tend to copy my posts to notepad so I have a backup just in case something like that happens...

quote:


Those Matthew verses are not teaching 'Apostolic Succession'. The church isn't built on Peter and his successors. The church is built on Christ and the teaching of the apostles, not the apostles themselves and their successors. I would encourage you to get John MacArthur's commentary on Matthew chapter 16 -23. He goes into this. If Peter and his papal successors are the foundation on which the church is built then why does Christ also teach that the greatest in the kingdom of heaven is someone who is like a little child in humility? Why didn't he say that Peter was the greatest? Matthew 16 doesn't teach that the Pope has authority equal to Christ, even, ex cathedra. There are two different forms of the Greek word for rock being used in that passage in Matthew 16.18-20. The Greek word for Peter is a different form of the Greek word in 'upon this rock'. One is a little rock (Peter), one is for a mountainous rock ('Upon this rock') - i.e. - a rock that is a mountain. [8D] I don't mean to offend, it's just that we must pursue being true to the word of God.


You know, I think I actually covered the whole "Petros/petra" bit before. But I'll be happy to go over it again. First of all, you're quite correct that we should go back to the originating language to clear things up. But you must remember.... Jesus wasn't speaking Greek at the time. He was speaking Aramaic. Matthew's gospel was actually written originally in Aramaic and later translated to Greek (possibly by Matthew himself!). We know this part from records kept by Eusebius of Caesarea.

Anyways unlike in Greek, Aramaic has but one word for "Rock", "Kepha" When you read the verse of Matthew 16:18 with the aramaic words, it's quite clear that Jesus said, "You are Kepha(Rock) and upon this Kepha(rock) I will build my Church." We can say with confidence that Jesus was speaking aramaic because it's in several places in the scriptures.
Matthew 27:46 springs to mind. When Our Blessed Lord was suffering on the cross He cried out, "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?" Which is Aramaic for "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" And later we note how the apostle Paul referred to Peter by the Aramaic name, "Cephas" (which is a transliteration in Greek of the Aramaic word "Kephas" btw) in 1 Corinthians 1:12, 1 Corinthians 3:22, 1 Corinthians 9:5, 1 Corinthians 15:5, Galatians 1:18, and Galatians 2:9.

Admittedly, if one looks strictly at the Greek, it can be confusing. But even if we didn't have Peter's Aramaic name we can still say with confidence that in Matthew 16:18 Our Beloved Lord Jesus is naming him as the Rock. But to do this will require a brief lesson in Greek grammar. :)

Now, in Greek, and indeed in many other languages, there are both masculine, feminine, and gender neutral noun forms. It's not common to the English language however. Anyways, the Greek word for rock is indeed "petra" which equates to "large stone" and a feminine word. However, since Peter is a guy, you can't use the feminine form for his name. It just wouldn't make sense grammatically. So they used the masculine spelling of "petra" which is of course "Petros" aka Peter. :)

And finally, to top things off, the differences in petra -vs- petros only applied to Attic Greek, not the Koine Greek that the gospels were written in. In Koine Greek "petra" and "petros" are exactly the same. If Jesus had wanted to contrast things and He was speaking Greek, He would have used the word "lithos" for Peter's name, which is more equivalent to "small stone" than "Petros" would have been.

Hope this helps clarify things!

quote:


God bless and lead and keep you in the Christ,
Catherwood



May the Lord bless you as well! :D

-Lurker

*edit* Oooh! I made Junior member status with this post! How nifty!



bettyg51 -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 4:10:50 PM)

quote:

Thats not very nice.
If it said specifically in the bible that we need a pope, then I would agree that we need one. Since it does not, then we don't.


Why do we need a pope?

The following examples are based on "general" Protestant beliefs:
* The Lutheran Church believes in baptismal regeneration; the Baptist church does not.
* The Assembly of God denomination uses instrumental music during worship; the Church of Christ denomination believes instrumental music to be unbiblical.
* Presbyterians believe in unconditional atonement and irresistible grace; Methodists reject the two beliefs.
* The Lutheran church believes that worship should be liturgical; the Assembly of God church does not.
* The Church of Christ denomination believes that baptism should be administered by complete immersion only; Presbyterians believe pouring is acceptable.
* Methodists believe in the Trinity; Oneness Pentecostals do not.
* Lutherans affirms the fact that Mary remained a virgin throughout her life; Baptists reject this belief and say that Mary had other children.
* The Church of Christ denomination believes that baptism is necessary for salvation; the Baptist Church does not.
* The Methodist church accepts female ministers; the Baptist church rejects female ministers as unbiblical.
* Episcopalians baptize infants; Pentecostals believe infant baptism to be invalid.
* The Baptist Church teaches that once a person is saved; he is always saved and cannot fall from grace. The Church of Christ rejects this teaching as unscriptural.
With all these contradictory beliefs, there remains one common thing all these Protestants denominations believe. That is Sola Scriptura (the Bible and the Bible alone is the sole rule of faith). Although the above list is a "generalization" (for example not all Baptists are opposed to female ministers), it is accurate enough to demonstrate the result of sola scriptura. Is it not odd that all these Protestant Churches base their beliefs on the same Bible, yet their beliefs differ in so many ways? Some final questions:
Does the truth matter? See Galatians 1:8-9 "...if anyone preaches a gospel to you other than the one you received, let a curse be upon him!" Yes! It does!
How does anyone know what is the truth? See 1 Timothy 3:15 "...if I should be delayed you will know what kind of conduct befits a member of God's household, the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of truth." What church existed in 33 A.D. and which one still teaches the same doctrines? Study the history of Christianity by reading a book called Early Church Fathers and you will see this church is the Catholic Church.
Betty G.



GoodME -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 5:05:51 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: catherwood
Why didn't he say that Peter was the greatest?

Funny, I have always seen the Pope as the greatest servant of the Church, having given up his own life, his agenda, family, personal goals etc. to serve God by serving Church.

This subordination of self to something else is what makes one "least" in my opinion. "Greats" aspire to personal achievement and glory.

Just an opinion.



sadiebelle -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 7:01:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bettyg51

quote:

Thats not very nice.
If it said specifically in the bible that we need a pope, then I would agree that we need one. Since it does not, then we don't.


Why do we need a pope?

The following examples are based on "general" Protestant beliefs:
* The Lutheran Church believes in baptismal regeneration; the Baptist church does not.
* The Assembly of God denomination uses instrumental music during worship; the Church of Christ denomination believes instrumental music to be unbiblical.
* Presbyterians believe in unconditional atonement and irresistible grace; Methodists reject the two beliefs.
* The Lutheran church believes that worship should be liturgical; the Assembly of God church does not.
* The Church of Christ denomination believes that baptism should be administered by complete immersion only; Presbyterians believe pouring is acceptable.
* Methodists believe in the Trinity; Oneness Pentecostals do not.
* Lutherans affirms the fact that Mary remained a virgin throughout her life; Baptists reject this belief and say that Mary had other children.
* The Church of Christ denomination believes that baptism is necessary for salvation; the Baptist Church does not.
* The Methodist church accepts female ministers; the Baptist church rejects female ministers as unbiblical.
* Episcopalians baptize infants; Pentecostals believe infant baptism to be invalid.
* The Baptist Church teaches that once a person is saved; he is always saved and cannot fall from grace. The Church of Christ rejects this teaching as unscriptural.
With all these contradictory beliefs, there remains one common thing all these Protestants denominations believe. That is Sola Scriptura (the Bible and the Bible alone is the sole rule of faith). Although the above list is a "generalization" (for example not all Baptists are opposed to female ministers), it is accurate enough to demonstrate the result of sola scriptura. Is it not odd that all these Protestant Churches base their beliefs on the same Bible, yet their beliefs differ in so many ways? Some final questions:
Does the truth matter? See Galatians 1:8-9 "...if anyone preaches a gospel to you other than the one you received, let a curse be upon him!" Yes! It does!
How does anyone know what is the truth? See 1 Timothy 3:15 "...if I should be delayed you will know what kind of conduct befits a member of God's household, the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of truth." What church existed in 33 A.D. and which one still teaches the same doctrines? Study the history of Christianity by reading a book called Early Church Fathers and you will see this church is the Catholic Church.
Betty G.

Then of course there are those of us who can't stand having to subscribe to a man made theology or doctrine or church "guidline" and I'd be hard pressed to find a single church in the ones listed above where I didn't think there was something man made about the way they practice the organization of their service.
*whew*
So, for those of us who go to a church of NO denomination...WE don't feel WE need a Pope.



bishop35 -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 8:35:04 PM)

When Jesus said that he was the only way to heaven, I thought in my mind, 'what Jesus is trying to say here, is that He is the only way to heaven'. I figured it out all by myself! Wow! I didnt need some guy in vatican city to tell me what it means. I read the bible and learned a lot of things. I even study it. Hope I'm getting it right. My pastor seems to think I'm doin o.k., and my family too. Guess the pope dosent need to tell us how to interpret scripture. Thats pretty weak anyway. Anybody that can read and comprehend can understand its teachings. The authors of it wrote it some we could understand it. Does the Pope think we are all ignorant, and need him to think for us?



sdaw -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/18/2005 9:20:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bishop35

When Jesus said that he was the only way to heaven, I thought in my mind, 'what Jesus is trying to say here, is that He is the only way to heaven'. I figured it out all by myself! Wow! I didnt need some guy in vatican city to tell me what it means. I read the bible and learned a lot of things. I even study it. Hope I'm getting it right. My pastor seems to think I'm doin o.k., and my family too. Guess the pope dosent need to tell us how to interpret scripture. Thats pretty weak anyway. Anybody that can read and comprehend can understand its teachings. The authors of it wrote it some we could understand it. Does the Pope think we are all ignorant, and need him to think for us?


Dear bishop,
Only Protestants say that the Church tells us how to interpret Scripture. The Church mostly tells us how not to interpret Scripture. And, about some things, the Church has given a definitive answer. The Church, through the power and presence of the Holy Spirit, reserves the right to have the authorative word about the Word.

Come Holy Spirit!



Lurker -> RE: Why do we need a Pope? (4/19/2005 12:33:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bishop35

When Jesus said that he was the only way to heaven, I thought in my mind, 'what Jesus is trying to say here, is that He is the only way to heaven'. I figured it out all by myself! Wow! I didnt need some guy in vatican city to tell me what it means. I read the bible and learned a lot of things. I even study it. Hope I'm getting it right. My pastor seems to think I'm doin o.k., and my family too. Guess the pope dosent need to tell us how to interpret scripture. Thats pretty weak anyway. Anybody that can read and comprehend can understand its teachings. The authors of it wrote it some we could understand it. Does the Pope think we are all ignorant, and need him to think for us?


*emphasis added*

You've hit the nail on the head Bishop! You just pointed out the reason we NEED the Church structure and competent leaders. Catholics believe that the office of the Pope was created by Our Blessed Saviour, Jesus to help us make sure we're getting things right. We can have faith in the Church that Our Most Holy Lord Jesus started when He appointed Peter to be the Rock. Jesus gave Peter the keys to the kingdom of Heaven and the authority to act in His name, guiding us in the Truth. And it was Jesus who told Peter and the apostles to pass on His teachings to us. Which Catholics believe they have done. With the Church, we have 2000 years of history and debate. And for 2000 years the Church has withstood assault from without, and indeed within. But as Our Beloved Saviour promised, He would be with us until the end of days. His Church would stand against the forces of the fallen one. For 2000 years, the Church has been there. And it has promulgated the teachings of the Apostles, who were in turn taught by the Most Blessed Lord Jesus.

With the Church we have the guidance of the Apostles and their successors, and also, the guidance of the Holy Spirit whom Our Most Blessed Lord Jesus sent to help us.

The Pope doesn't believe us to be ignorant. He encourages us to be all that Our Blessed Lord would have us be. He was given a special task by Jesus to help guide us! The Church isn't a prison binding us to an archaic set of rules, it's freedom! The Pope and the rest of the Magesterium have given their lives to serve us! They dedicate themselves in service to Our Lord and Saviour, they meditate on His will and pray daily for His mercy and guidance. They rely on His love and guidance to help us know what is right. Through the Church's teachings we avoid the snares of the fallen one. And we grow closer in our walk with God.

Don't think of the Pope as a stern father figure chastising us, think of him as a beloved elder brother who makes sure we are doing Our Father's will and guides us.



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