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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 7:33:39 AM
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HenriettasCat
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I think that is much easier said than done charity. Perhaps you are an academic but I am a mother, not a scientist or a researcher. It took me ages to decide whether and which vaccines to give my children. I felt so responsible and of course I didn't want to do anything that was going to hurt them.
It is very hard to sift through the information and decide what is right and what is not, and its very hard to approach it without guilt and emotion - let alone have the time to do it thouroughly. After a year of agonising I finally came to a point of peace and faith. I felt that I had made the best decision I could by vaccinating and I was prepared to live with that decision whatever the results. No regrets. Thankfully I have 2 healthy little boys who do not appear to be affected adversley.
I think its also worth considering that if a researcher wishes to make their name known all they have to do is make up a bunch of theories and their name will be in lights oh, and they'll sell lots of books.
There are just too many 'may's and 'could's in some of these papers for my liking. I do understand that there is a big difference between a theory and something that has been absolutely proven.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 8:23:03 AM
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charity7
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FAITH It takes a lot of faith and trust in the Lord to have peace about what is right and wrong---something it has taken me years to get to ---OH if only I could go back and do over some things I now have knowledge about!! Faith and trust in God !!
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 10:00:45 AM
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rebeccalynn3348
Posts: 161
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Again I don't claim to be an expert and I apologize if some things are not coming out as clear as I would hope. I know this can be an emotional and confusing topic. There is so much information out there and there is faulty information on both sides of the issue; I know that. I have made a valiant effort in trying to weed through that and stick to research that has large study groups and reputable sources. I know one thing for absolute certain...that you all love your children and we all want the best for them. This is something I struggled with for awhile and after giving it over to God and praying for I can't tell you how long...this is the decision that God has given me peace about and continues to. I am sure others have prayed and feel they should vaccinate and I would never tell you not to follow God's will. From my experience MANY parents do not know this information (or any information except what the media, doctors, and government) tell them. I believe it is in everyone's best interest to know both sides of the issue and that is my drive to do this.
There is one thing said that I want to comment on and I don't remember who but someone wrote in that there is no longer thimerosol in the MMR shots...this is not always the case. It was recommended that pharmacuetical companies take the thimerosol out not mandated and the existing shots were not taken off the shelves. In fact, there was a newsbroadcast where they had patients go in and ask for thimerosol-free shots and come to find out they still had it in it. The doctor honestly thought it was out, but didn't look at the ingredients. But this isn't even anything that needs to argued over..parents can always ask for thimerosol-free shots and I encourage you to even ask to look at the ingredients yourself so you know for absoloute certain.
Here is a shining example, however, how a toxic ingredient was deemed so unsafe that it was recommended it be taken out...so it wasn't safe!
Also I am truly trying to give sources as I go through...I will continue to do that.
Thank you for ALL of your responses. I do want to apologize for the comment I made about if you vaccinate you were indoctrinated...that was wrong because I know many parents research first and decide to vaccinate. I just feel that we are only being told one side of the issue and they do a really good job of covering up the reported reactions and deaths caused by vaccines...in fact many times doctors won't report reactions and completely deny a link if a child gets a reaction even hours later! I know my neighbor's daughter got two sets of convulsions after her DPT shots and they told her it was in no way related! We will never know the true numbers of children hurt by these vaccines because many medical professionals and school administrators (not all but many) refuse to report...Read the book A Shot in Dark by Barbara Loe Fisher (co-founder of the National Vaccine Information Center) and she discusses this in detail.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 10:08:36 AM
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rebeccalynn3348
Posts: 161
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Also I am sorry if this thread has been discussed already...I am new and don't have the time to look through every forum and every thread to see if it has already been talked about..I dont mean that to sound rude I really just don't and I assummed if it has already been discussed and there was an issue with that the I would be kicked off...isn't that how it works?? Like I said I'm new at this.
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A Happy Marriage is the union of two forgivers.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 10:24:57 AM
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manda59
Posts: 6024
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From: Hampshire, UK
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rebeccalynn3348
There is one thing said that I want to comment on and I don't remember who but someone wrote in that there is no longer thimerosol in the MMR shots...this is not always the case. It was recommended that pharmacuetical companies take the thimerosol out not mandated and the existing shots were not taken off the shelves. In fact, there was a newsbroadcast where they had patients go in and ask for thimerosol-free shots and come to find out they still had it in it. The doctor honestly thought it was out, but didn't look at the ingredients. But this isn't even anything that needs to argued over..parents can always ask for thimerosol-free shots and I encourage you to even ask to look at the ingredients yourself so you know for absoloute certain.
So, rebecca, are the CDC lying on their website?
I posted this to you earlier but you haven't responded to it at all.
quote:
ORIGINAL: manda59
Also from the CDC website:
"Today, with the exception of some Influenza (flu) vaccines, none of the vaccines used in the U.S. to protect preschool children against 12 infectious diseases contain thimerosal as a preservative."
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 12:20:42 PM
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rebeccalynn3348
Posts: 161
Joined: 11/15/2006
From: MD
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manda59 - I am saying that things are not clear..if people are going in to get shots and they still contain thimerosol although its been said that it was taken out..then yes I would have to say the CDC has put a false statement on their website..the fact is they are not explaining the situation...they may make thimerosol-free vaccines, but they have both thimerosol-free and vaccines with thimerosol on the shelves...the point is they don't tell parents to ask and take caution..they say there is no evidence that thimersol is a link to anything yet they are saying they are taking it out...does not make sense to me..if they are so certain it is safe then why take it out??
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A Happy Marriage is the union of two forgivers.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 12:27:02 PM
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rebeccalynn3348
Posts: 161
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From: MD
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I just found this on CDC website...why are they sending mixed messages???
Common substances found in vaccines include:
Aluminum gels or salts of aluminum which are added as adjuvants to help the vaccine stimulate production of antibodies to fight off diseases and aid other substances in their action. In vaccines, adjuvants may be added to help promote an earlier response, more potent response, or more persistent immune response to disease.
Antibiotics which are added to vaccines to prevent the growth of germs (bacteria) in vaccine cultures.
Egg protein which is found in vaccines prepared using chick embryos. Ordinarily, persons who are able to eat eggs or egg products safely can receive these vaccines.
Formaldehyde which is used to inactivate bacterial products for toxoid vaccines. It is also used to kill unwanted viruses and bacteria that might be found in cultures used to produce vaccines.
Monosodium glutamate (MSG) and 2-phenoxy-ethanol which are used as stabilizers in a few vaccines to help the vaccine remain unchanged even in the presence of forces such as heat, light, acidity, humidity etc. MSG is also found in many foods, especially Asian foods and flavor enhancers.
Thimerosal which is a preservative that might be added to prevent the vaccine from spoiling. Thimerosal is also found in some contact lens solutions and throat sprays.
As you can see they say in some pages it is not there or in trace amounts and then turn around and say its still in there...this is the unclear things I'm talking about...either its in there or it isn't...
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 12:30:41 PM
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rebeccalynn3348
Posts: 161
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From: MD
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Just a side note also..either thimerosol is safe or it isn't...right? Mercury is the second most poisonous substance known to man next to uranium so that tells me it IS NOT safe (they even tell pregnant women not to eat fish wish contains trace amounts of mercury..far less than vaccines)..so if it is safe why are they taking it out and if it is dangerous why are they leaving it in the flu vaccines (going off your information about it still being in influenza shots)?
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A Happy Marriage is the union of two forgivers.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 12:58:40 PM
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CindyBrady
Posts: 5
Joined: 11/20/2006
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I don't believe a post should resemble a PhD thesis but you might want to become familiar with the following words etc. Multifactorial for starters, also the specialization of labor and throwing the baby out with the bath water. I don't agree with Rebecca's anti vaccination agenda but I found it interesting that Cynthia the moderator mentioned her use of homeopathic remedies and most of mainstream medicine views this as quackery. Visit the site called Quackwatch. She probably wouldn't appreciate anyone talking down to her on this issue as she appears to be towards Rebecca who as I already mentioned I don't support on this matter. Before you delete my post or anyone else's remember rude is subjective.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 1:00:24 PM
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Jess75
Posts: 30
Joined: 7/26/2006
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Cynthia,
my apologies for offending you, its just that when I read a post that says "we feel...", or "we have already heard this...", for one does come across to me as a little cliquey, especially to a new member here, and it dosnt take into consideration the new members to the forum who havent already heard it all, that do want to talk about it, or get info.
Manda,
yes, my recently passed sister is somewhat of a factor for me, having seen what the Lupus did to her body, and having read that the vaccines cause Lupus later in life. But this was an issue I was already concerned about even before she died. To me, it is just a scary decision to make for a child either way. But I thank you for your prayers, they are always needed!
And the aborted fetal tissue thing is definately an issue for me. It also makes sense to me who has the more motivating factor, and I do believe our govt is corrupt, and I do believe it is largely due to control, and greed. So to me, the financial aspect of the pharm's making all that money is valid. And I do believe they would put their money way before consumer health.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 1:10:30 PM
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manda59
Posts: 6024
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: Hampshire, UK
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jess75
yes, my recently passed sister is somewhat of a factor for me, having seen what the Lupus did to her body, and having read that the vaccines cause Lupus later in life. But this was an issue I was already concerned about even before she died. To me, it is just a scary decision to make for a child either way. But I thank you for your prayers, they are always needed!
Are people suggesting vaccination (all vaccinations) actually causes lupus, or that the effect of a multiple vaccine on an already vulnerable immune system could cause it?
quote:
And the aborted fetal tissue thing is definately an issue for me.
Do you also disagree with organ donation from children and adults?
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"Once again....drum roll please! Manda is right"
doinkdom, October 2008
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 1:16:34 PM
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rebeccalynn3348
Posts: 161
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From: MD
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manda59 - I know you weren't asking me, but what does organ transplants have to do with using the tissue of aborted babies in vaccines? Are you honestly suggesting they are the same thing??
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A Happy Marriage is the union of two forgivers.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 3:13:30 PM
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manda59
Posts: 6024
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From: Hampshire, UK
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rebeccalynn3348
manda59 - I know you weren't asking me, but what does organ transplants have to do with using the tissue of aborted babies in vaccines? Are you honestly suggesting they are the same thing??
So long as they were not being aborted simply for the tissue, then I don't see much, if any, difference.
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"Once again....drum roll please! Manda is right"
doinkdom, October 2008
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 3:37:49 PM
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agapetos
Posts: 5393
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: This side of the lil duck pond!
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rebeccalynn3348
Also I am sorry if this thread has been discussed already...I am new and don't have the time to look through every forum and every thread to see if it has already been talked about..I dont mean that to sound rude I really just don't and I assummed if it has already been discussed and there was an issue with that the I would be kicked off...isn't that how it works?? Like I said I'm new at this.
If there was another current thread about vaccines this one would have been locked and it would have been explained why in the last post of the locked thread ~ just as it was when you started the same thread about vaccines in 2 different places. One was locked.
As regards to being kicked off for doing that ~ probably a little extreme unless you are a repeat offender ~ and as you said, you are knew at this and know now that it shouldn't be done.
It really is worth rereading tos to familiarise yourself with things. Tos should be reread regularly anyhow because it does change. There's also a folder called 'feedback and help' (I think) where you can post questions on if you're not sure about something.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 5:58:56 PM
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cynthia
Posts: 7982
Joined: 3/31/2005
From: Beautiful Puget Sound Region
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I should be packing, not typing, but I’m going to chime in then leave. 
quote:
ORIGINAL: rebeccalynn3348
Also I am sorry if this thread has been discussed already...I am new and don't have the time to look through every forum and every thread to see if it has already been talked about..I dont mean that to sound rude I really just don't and I assummed if it has already been discussed and there was an issue with that the I would be kicked off...isn't that how it works?? Like I said I'm new at this.
You are fine in starting this thread. It is not currently being discussed elsewhere in forums that I know of.
quote:
ORIGINAL: rebeccalynn3348
manda59 - I am saying that things are not clear..if people are going in to get shots and they still contain thimerosol although its been said that it was taken out..then yes I would have to say the CDC has put a false statement on their website..the fact is they are not explaining the situation...they may make thimerosol-free vaccines, but they have both thimerosol-free and vaccines with thimerosol on the shelves...the point is they don't tell parents to ask and take caution..they say there is no evidence that thimersol is a link to anything yet they are saying they are taking it out...does not make sense to me..if they are so certain it is safe then why take it out??
From the CDC:
quote:
Substantial progress has been made in the effort to reduce thimerosal exposure from vaccines. Today, with the exception of some flu vaccines, none of the vaccines used in the U.S. to protect preschool aged children against 12 infectious diseases contain thimerosal as a preservative. The vaccines with trace amount of thimerosal licensed to date contain less than 0.5 micrograms of mercury per dose, that is, a given dose of vaccine contains less than 1 part per million.
Events that contributed to accomplishing this goal include the licensure of a thimerosal free Hepatitis B Vaccine (Recombinant) manufactured by Merck and Company in August 1999. FDA licensed another hepatitis B vaccine with only trace amounts of thimerosal, manufactured by GlaxoSmithKline in March 2000. A supplement for a new formulation of Aventis Pasteur's DTaP Vaccine with only a trace amount of thimerosal was approved in March 2001. Additionally, Wyeth-Lederle Vaccines and Pediatrics now only markets a single-dose, thimerosal-free formulation of its Haemophilus b (Hib) Conjugate Vaccine in the U.S. Thus, two hepatitis B vaccines are thimerosal free, four Hib vaccines are thimerosal free, and two DTaP vaccines are thimerosal free.
Link to quote.
I cannot imagine that any doctors have vaccine on their shelves that have been there for seven years!
quote:
ORIGINAL: rebeccalynn3348
Just a side note also..either thimerosol is safe or it isn't...right? Wrong. Not all people respond to all substances the same way. This is clearly seen in people with sensativity to various things that are good for most people. Using celery again, celery is normally good for people. I was told by a doctor that it could kill me and I should never have it. You cannot make a blanket statement that a substance is bad for everyone.
It is also true that some substances are helpful in small quantities that in larger quantities are deadly. Take aspirin for example. You can take aspirin to save your life during a heart attack, but if you down the whole bottle, you may survive the heart attack, but die from aspirin poisoning. This is the case with many substances. It is also true that some people will react negatively to even one aspirin. You don’t know who that will be. This is of course true of vaccinations as well. Most people will be fine with them, but a few will have severely bad reactions to them.
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RE: vaccines - 11/22/2006 11:38:53 PM
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Jess75
Posts: 30
Joined: 7/26/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: manda59
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jess75
yes, my recently passed sister is somewhat of a factor for me, having seen what the Lupus did to her body, and having read that the vaccines cause Lupus later in life. But this was an issue I was already concerned about even before she died. To me, it is just a scary decision to make for a child either way. But I thank you for your prayers, they are always needed!
Are people suggesting vaccination (all vaccinations) actually causes lupus, or that the effect of a multiple vaccine on an already vulnerable immune system could cause it?
quote:
And the aborted fetal tissue thing is definately an issue for me.
Do you also disagree with organ donation from children and adults?
From what I can gather, the vaccines have an effect on the immune system, eventually causing Lupus, and other auto immune diseases. Considering the chemicals involved, it makes sense to me...
And yes, I do agree with organ donation from adults & children. Guess I am a little sensitive about the fetuses, since I dont know how the whole process works, and it seems a little creepy to me to have them injected into my daughter, for reasons which are unknown, and are not being explained or mentioned by my doctor.
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RE: vaccines - 11/23/2006 11:24:01 AM
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stampinlady
Posts: 1538
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Northern IL
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quote:
From what I can gather, the vaccines have an effect on the immune system, eventually causing Lupus, and other auto immune diseases. Considering the chemicals involved, it makes sense to me...
But where's the proof and how do Dr.'s know that it isn't environmental or from the foods we eat or just that our bodies are sinful and are breakin down?
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RE: vaccines - 11/23/2006 9:11:06 PM
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Glaedr
Posts: 1
Joined: 11/3/2006
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Hey y'all!
What's the skinny on the PPD tuberculosis skin test? I won't do it for religious reasons, but what are the health issues?
Glaedr, out.
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RE: vaccines - 11/24/2006 3:46:19 AM
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3cappuccinosmom
Posts: 2516
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
What's the skinny on the PPD tuberculosis skin test?
My husband had to get several because he's from Africa and worked in the health field there. He got a letter from the state Health Dept. saying he's clear of the disease and doesn't need one again--his reaction was so bad last time we were genuinely afraid he would lose his arm.  He also had to take the 9 months of medication because of the reaction, even though he doesn't have active TB.
I think if you've been exposed to TB, it would be wise to have the skin test. A major reaction would lead to x-rays to be sure you don't have the active disease, and then it's done.
Why would someone *not* want to know if they were tubercular? It's a nasty disease, not to mention highly contagious.  Once you have it, you have to undergo a long period of medication, you run the risk of infecting others, and if the disease can't be treated, your lungs will fill up with fluid that either must be drained or you'll "drown". Here's the cdc's info about active TB, treatment, and med side-effects.
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RE: vaccines - 11/24/2006 10:54:11 AM
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cynthia
Posts: 7982
Joined: 3/31/2005
From: Beautiful Puget Sound Region
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Attention: Moderator's Note: Attention
The TB test is not a vaccination and is off topic for this thread. If you would like to start a discussion about the TB test, please do so in Health and Fitness.
Please do not discuss this nudge on forums or send me pm's about it. If you would like to discuss this nudge, please contact administration at community@salemwebnetwork.com.
Thank you.
Cynthia
Forums Volunteer
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) that would seem to indicate that occasionally there is misinformation and corruption even in agencies like the CDC.
