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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/1/2008 5:49:40 PM
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cow451
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
Well, here's the evidence that has converted me to a demon-possession believer. I've obviously been wrong about everything. This poor Wisconsin woman had to defend herself against her own demon-possessed daughter. And the police and DA are now going to persecute her. So sad.
You disappoint me.
I would not make fun of demons because of something obviously stupid like that - nor stand close to anyone who does.
Cow, a rule of thumb for you: Just because there are counterfeits doesn't mean there isn't the real deal somewhere. Unbelievers that I talk with quite often make fun of us by pointing out the obvious frauds rather than discussing the genuine article.
On the contrary, this woman could not be classified as a "fraud". She truly believed her daughter was possessed. She had no other motive. It's a classic, horribly sad case of attributing something evil to a medical "problem": sleepwalking. Unfortunately it had tragic results.
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/1/2008 5:54:33 PM
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JimboFletch
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
Well, here's the evidence that has converted me to a demon-possession believer. I've obviously been wrong about everything. This poor Wisconsin woman had to defend herself against her own demon-possessed daughter. And the police and DA are now going to persecute her. So sad.
You disappoint me.
I would not make fun of demons because of something obviously stupid like that - nor stand close to anyone who does.
Cow, a rule of thumb for you: Just because there are counterfeits doesn't mean there isn't the real deal somewhere. Unbelievers that I talk with quite often make fun of us by pointing out the obvious frauds rather than discussing the genuine article.
On the contrary, this woman could not be classified as a "fraud". She truly believed her daughter was possessed. She had no other motive. It's a classic, horribly sad case of attributing something evil to a medical "problem": sleepwalking. Unfortunately it had tragic results.
Believing something doesn't make it to be true. You are playing a game I wouldn't, sir. Your choice, your consequences.
Are you also of the false impression that Satan is a myth?
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/1/2008 6:01:08 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3711
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
Well, here's the evidence that has converted me to a demon-possession believer. I've obviously been wrong about everything. This poor Wisconsin woman had to defend herself against her own demon-possessed daughter. And the police and DA are now going to persecute her. So sad.
You disappoint me.
I would not make fun of demons because of something obviously stupid like that - nor stand close to anyone who does.
Cow, a rule of thumb for you: Just because there are counterfeits doesn't mean there isn't the real deal somewhere. Unbelievers that I talk with quite often make fun of us by pointing out the obvious frauds rather than discussing the genuine article.
On the contrary, this woman could not be classified as a "fraud". She truly believed her daughter was possessed. She had no other motive. It's a classic, horribly sad case of attributing something evil to a medical "problem": sleepwalking. Unfortunately it had tragic results.
Believing something doesn't make it to be true. You are playing a game I wouldn't, sir. Your choice, your consequences.
Are you also of the false impression that Satan is a myth?
That's probably getting off topic although obviously related to a degree. That would be a great thread topic if you want to start one in Doctrine or Bible forums. BTW, your question isn't as much a question as a statement. Like, "Are you still a heretic?", for example.
And, I absolutely agree that believing something to be true doesn't make it so. And, I'm not playing.
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Wenn zuerst Sie nicht gelingen, Versuch, versuch wieder. Geben Sie dann auf. Es gibt keinen punkt, in ein zu sein, verdammt Narren darum. -- W. C. Fields
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/1/2008 7:27:20 PM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
Are you also of the false impression that Satan is a myth?
That's probably getting off topic although obviously related to a degree. That would be a great thread topic if you want to start one in Doctrine or Bible forums. BTW, your question isn't as much a question as a statement. Like, "Are you still a heretic?", for example.
Since Satan is the head of the powers of demonic possession we are discussing I do not think it is off topic.
Do you believe Satan is real? Your answer might help us to understand your position on demonic possession a little better.
For the record; I do believe Satan is real, alive, well, and is the prince of this earth.
Thanks
RC
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/1/2008 7:29:47 PM
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Qtman
Posts: 11235
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
Are you also of the false impression that Satan is a myth?
That's probably getting off topic although obviously related to a degree. That would be a great thread topic if you want to start one in Doctrine or Bible forums. BTW, your question isn't as much a question as a statement. Like, "Are you still a heretic?", for example.
Since Satan is the head of the powers of demonic possession we are discussing I do not think it is off topic.
Do you believe Satan is real? Your answer might help us to understand your position on demonic possession a little better.
For the record; I do believe Satan is real, alive, well, and is the prince of this earth.
Thanks
RC
Yeah Preacher satan is alive and well. He yelled at me today. Fortuntely God yelled back for me.
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/4/2008 3:52:46 AM
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Marcus.
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Reminds me of a joke.
Sunday morning in Bronx, New York. The church is packed and the devil decides to pay a visit. The doors burst open; a black cloud rolls in with the devil in its midst. People jump out of the pews and run outdoors, screaming - all except for two people. One is the Pastor, the other is an old man.
Satan is a bit perplexed. He points to the Pastor and says, "You! I can understand why you didn't run away, you are in your Lord's house, you preach against me everyday and you aren't afraid of me.
But YOU (points to the old man), why didn't you run out scared like everyone else?"
The old man crosses one leg over the other and replies, "I've been married to you sister for 36 years!"
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/4/2008 8:52:58 AM
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rcjames
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That's a good one Marcus, how aboout.
A young man was wanting his papers from a denomination so he could Pastor a Chruch, while being vetted by the powers that be he was ask if he believed in the devil. His reply was 'No I don't".
The nomination board went immediately into executive session and there was much concern about the yourg man not believing something so plainly laid out in Scripture.
One old seasoned preacher said, "Oh give the boy his papers and a Church to Pastor, after he has a couple of Deacn's meetings; he will surely believe in the devil then.
Thsnks
RC
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/4/2008 11:11:27 AM
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Memaw.
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Even Michael believed satan was real.
Jude 1 NLT
9 But even Michael, one of the mightiest of the angels, did not dare accuse the devil of blasphemy, but simply said, “The Lord rebuke you!” (This took place when Michael was arguing with the devil about Moses’ body.)
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/4/2008 11:16:29 AM
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DaveW
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
That's a good one Marcus, how about.
A young man was wanting his papers from a denomination so he could pastor a Church, while being vetted by the powers that be he was ask if he believed in the devil. His reply was 'No I don't".
The nomination board went immediately into executive session and there was much concern about the young man not believing something so plainly laid out in Scripture.
One old seasoned preacher said, "Oh give the boy his papers and a Church to Pastor, after he has a couple of deacon's meetings; he will surely believe in the devil then. Too true, Too true.
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/5/2008 9:23:54 PM
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2by2
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quote:
Or, maybe she sees through you.
Pretty brazen for someone who doesn't even know me.
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/6/2008 2:35:01 PM
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cow451
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 2by2
quote:
Or, maybe she sees through you.
Pretty brazen for someone who doesn't even know me.
Please walk over to the nearest mirror and recall who referred to your mother-in-law as demon-possessed.
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Wenn zuerst Sie nicht gelingen, Versuch, versuch wieder. Geben Sie dann auf. Es gibt keinen punkt, in ein zu sein, verdammt Narren darum. -- W. C. Fields
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/6/2008 2:45:01 PM
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rcjames
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Actually the assumption that a mother-in-law is demon possessed in not a rarity in the least.
Thanks
RC
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/6/2008 6:04:12 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
Actually I am and I have nice in-laws.
Which is a rarity, good for you and lucky for you.
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
I believe Satan exists, but not the Bogeyman Satan of fundamentalists.
That last part of your statement could be discussed thoroughly, but for sake of a clean and concise discussion - do you believe Satan exists as in how he and his demonic are described in Scripture?
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/6/2008 6:09:25 PM
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cow451
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
Actually I am and I have nice in-laws.
Which is a rarity, good for you and lucky for you.
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
I believe Satan exists, but not the Bogeyman Satan of fundamentalists.
That last part of your statement could be discussed thoroughly, but for sake of a clean and concise discussion - do you believe Satan exists as in how he and his demonic are described in Scripture?
If you mean how the Bible presents them "literally", no.
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Wenn zuerst Sie nicht gelingen, Versuch, versuch wieder. Geben Sie dann auf. Es gibt keinen punkt, in ein zu sein, verdammt Narren darum. -- W. C. Fields
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/6/2008 6:13:17 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
If you mean how the Bible presents them "literally", no.
So then you do not hold Jesus to be truthful nor the writ of Scripture to be trustworthy?
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/6/2008 6:18:49 PM
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cow451
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
If you mean how the Bible presents them "literally", no.
So then you do not hold Jesus to be truthful nor the writ of Scripture to be trustworthy?
Ahhhh, the fundamentalist twists and the Bible worship. I do, but I don't hold to Biblical inerrancy.
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Wenn zuerst Sie nicht gelingen, Versuch, versuch wieder. Geben Sie dann auf. Es gibt keinen punkt, in ein zu sein, verdammt Narren darum. -- W. C. Fields
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/6/2008 6:25:18 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
Ahhhh, the fundamentalist twists and the Bible worship. I do, but I don't hold to Biblical inerrancy.
The Bible is the Word of God for all of mankind. We can't speak out of both sides of our mouth on this issue, for either one holds the 66 books of the Bible to be His Word or one does not.
I know being so absolute in our current society is not a popular thing to do or announce... but for someone to say that the words of Jesus and the apostles, disciples are not trustworthy but that you do hold some parts to be so, is an oxymoron and a double-edged sword.
Reminds me of the 'Jesus Seminar' folk whom I have spent many years personally speaking with because one of their main cohorts was my wife's professor at DePaul University.
What many self-professing Christians fail to realize is that the doctrine of Biblical inerrancy is an extremely important one because the truth does matter. Beliefs have consequences. This issue reflects on the character of God and is foundational to our understanding of everything the Bible teaches.
The Bible stands or falls as a whole. If a major newspaper were routinely discovered to contain errors, it would be quickly discredited.
It would make no difference to say, “All the errors are confined to page 3.” For a paper to be reliable in any of its parts, it must be factual throughout.
In the same way, if the Bible is inaccurate when it speaks of geology, why should its theology be trusted? It’s either a trustworthy document, or it isn’t.
Based on the evidence available - the manuscript, the archaeological, the historical, the science of statistical probability, etc.. with each turn of the archaeological spade the veracity for what the Bible claims it is shines more and more.
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/6/2008 6:31:48 PM
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cow451
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
Ahhhh, the fundamentalist twists and the Bible worship. I do, but I don't hold to Biblical inerrancy.
The Bible is the Word of God for all of mankind. We can't speak out of both sides of our mouth on this issue, for either one holds the 66 books of the Bible to be His Word or one does not.
I know being so absolute in our current society is not a popular thing to do or announce... but for someone to say that the words of Jesus and the apostles, disciples are not trustworthy but that you do hold some parts to be so, is an oxymoron and a double-edged sword.
Reminds me of the 'Jesus Seminar' folk whom I have spent many years personally speaking with because one of their main cohorts was my wife's professor at DePaul University.
What many self-professing Christians fail to realize is that the doctrine of Biblical inerrancy is an extremely important one because the truth does matter. Beliefs have consequences. This issue reflects on the character of God and is foundational to our understanding of everything the Bible teaches.
The Bible stands or falls as a whole. If a major newspaper were routinely discovered to contain errors, it would be quickly discredited.
It would make no difference to say, “All the errors are confined to page 3.” For a paper to be reliable in any of its parts, it must be factual throughout.
In the same way, if the Bible is inaccurate when it speaks of geology, why should its theology be trusted? It’s either a trustworthy document, or it isn’t.
Based on the evidence available - the manuscript, the archaeological, the historical, the science of statistical probability, etc.. with each turn of the archaeological spade the veracity for what the Bible claims it is shines more and more.
Feel better, now?
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Wenn zuerst Sie nicht gelingen, Versuch, versuch wieder. Geben Sie dann auf. Es gibt keinen punkt, in ein zu sein, verdammt Narren darum. -- W. C. Fields
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RE: A Case of Demonic Possession - 5/6/2008 6:40:05 PM
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earthless
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Cow,
If you don't want to respond, that is fine. No skin off my back, nothing will change for me nor detract from what is going on around me. But after 6 pages of discussion we finally got the meat of what many here did not understand where you were coming from.
I am not one of those that believes he can "argue" people into anything. But I am someone who will always speak from a Christian worldview and not be left without an answer to any question regarding faith. Why? Because, for me, the Bible is the litmus test for all things - God's absolute Word for all of mankind - inspired by God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.
The Bible’s message must be taken as a whole. It is not a mixture of doctrine that we are free to select from.
The Bible is our only rule for faith and practice. If it is not reliable, then on what do we base our beliefs? Jesus asks for our trust, and that includes trust in what He says in His Word.
Biblical inerrancy does not mean that we are to stop using our minds or accept what the Bible says blindly. We are commanded to study the Word (2 Timothy 2:15), and those who search it out are commended (Acts 17:11).
Also, we all recognize that there are difficult passages in the Bible, as well as sincere disagreements over interpretation. Our goal should be to approach Scripture reverently and prayerfully, and when we find something we don’t understand, we pray harder, study more, and - if the answer still eludes us - humbly acknowledge our own limitations in the face of the perfect Word of God.
But based on what you have shared, you do not agree with the above. Isn't free-will grand? 
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