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[Poll]
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To list or not to list.... ?
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| My 'list of qualities' for my future mate IS very important. |
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| My 'list of qualities' for my future mate is important. |
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| My 'list of qualities' for my future mate is NOT important. |
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| I am willing to change my 'list'. |
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| I trust God to provide my mate and don't rely on a 'list'. |
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| I don't have a 'list'. |
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Total Votes : 65
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(last vote on : 10/3/2008 1:16:53 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/29/2008 4:33:48 PM
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Dakotasunbeam
Posts: 914
Joined: 6/2/2005
From: Midwest USA
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John_O,
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ORIGINAL: John_O
quote:
ORIGINAL: Dakotasunbeam
Wish the world/people were as certain as you make them seem.
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ORIGINAL: John_O
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ORIGINAL: Dakotasunbeam
What if you married your exact list description female and suddenly after about 5 years of marriage she suddenly changed all of those characteristics, what then?
Then she would have to be mentally ill ( due to drugs or trauma) and we'd deal with it. People do not change suddenly outside of external influence.
Most people never change at all.
If she was struggling spiritually that would show up long before those characteristics changed and then the situation could be dealt with.
They're not. But God is. Why would He give me someone who is not fit for me (and who I'm not fit for)?
It's not about God giving you someone who is not fit for you. It's about whether a loving God would give one of His precious children a fallen human to marry. Humans are fallible, we break, we fall apart. Is God being cruel by giving a woman a man that will eventually get cancer? Or is that the cause of sin? Is it God's will that He gives a man a wife that will one day commit adultry against him? God forbid! It's fallen men who do such things. Sin is in the flesh, so is brokness, and more. Perfection will not come this side of heaven.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/29/2008 4:35:21 PM
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Dakotasunbeam
Posts: 914
Joined: 6/2/2005
From: Midwest USA
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One day I was watching the nightly news, and a valtrex comercial came on . . . and the couples were talking about "protecting" their partner. And I thought to myself, Okay, maybe I do have a list . . . not one with superficial prefernences, but safe ones--like, no STDs.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/29/2008 7:01:12 PM
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trainfan
Posts: 2478
Joined: 7/26/2007
From: neither here nor there
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Dakotasunbeam
One day I was watching the nightly news, and a valtrex comercial came on . . . and the couples were talking about "protecting" their partner. And I thought to myself, Okay, maybe I do have a list . . . not one with superficial prefernences, but safe ones--like, no STDs.
That is what I pointed out in my first post on this thread. Everyone has a list of some sort. I think you could also say "safe ones" are non-negotiables.
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Support your local economy, buy locally.
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You can't out-pick God.
Dr. Charles Stanley
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RE: To list or not to list.... ? - 3/29/2008 10:13:07 PM
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PreserveWildlife
Posts: 452
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: Tennessee
Status: offline
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No lists for me. Never saw the value in them.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/29/2008 10:28:24 PM
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John_O
Posts: 8015
Joined: 9/5/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Dakotasunbeam
John_O,
It's not about God giving you someone who is not fit for you. It's about whether a loving God would give one of His precious children a fallen human to marry. Humans are fallible, we break, we fall apart. Is God being cruel by giving a woman a man that will eventually get cancer? Or is that the cause of sin? Is it God's will that He gives a man a wife that will one day commit adultry against him? God forbid! It's fallen men who do such things. Sin is in the flesh, so is brokness, and more. Perfection will not come this side of heaven.
Of course. But if man and wife DECIDE to make their marriage work then they will not fall in their marriage. People don't just fall into adultery (for example) they toy with it and entertain it and finally convince themselves that it's OK. If you never allow yourslef to play with fire you never get burned. KWIM?
As to health problems etc. That's just life. It happens.
Once the vows are said the list no longer matters. All that matters is keeping your vows. Which is why it's so important to know your spouse before you say "I DO" Make sure their character is sound and they are really who they are saying they are. Because once you say "I Do" it doesn't matter who they are, you are with them until death do you part.
< Message edited by John_O -- 3/29/2008 10:34:41 PM >
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 4:58:28 PM
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John_O
Posts: 8015
Joined: 9/5/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: LabGuy
And now for something more relevant to the thread - a thought occurs to me: we have these lists of qualities we want in a mate. That's fine, but do we ever stop and hold ourselves up to those lists? Should we work up some sort of list of what we should be for our mates?
Five star Question!!! (Mods, can you star Robb's post?)
I do maintain a list of what I should be. It's kind of summarized in the "God will bring my new wife to me thread" but it's derived from the bible. A husband has certain duties that he must fulfill. He must lay down his life for his wife. He must love her as Christ loves the church. Theres' tons of details involved in that.
I'll admit I don't meet it. But I do try to do better each day.
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Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 5:10:34 PM
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WaitingforBoaz
Posts: 4235
Joined: 2/11/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
People don't just fall into adultery (for example) they toy with it and entertain it and finally convince themselves that it's OK. If you never allow yourslef to play with fire you never get burned. KWIM?
As a blanket state this is incorrect.
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ORIGINAL: LabGuy
I like to put it this way: "If you don't want to fall off a cliff, then don't tap-dance on the edge!"
That goes for all kinds of sin. We have a tendency with certain ones to want to see how close we can get without "actually" sinning. Maybe hoping to get a little bit of the thrill by getting right up to the edge, and then we act surprised when we fall headfirst into it.
I know I've experienced this, and it's probably safe to say I'm far from the only one. We need to heed God's advice that when we see the sign "Cliff Ahead" to turn around and go the other way.
And now for something more relevant to the thread - a thought occurs to me: we have these lists of qualities we want in a mate. That's fine, but do we ever stop and hold ourselves up to those lists? Should we work up some sort of list of what we should be for our mates?
-Robb
Wow! So true Robb. I do have a list for that and it is very long....I try each day of my life to become that person on the list it doesn't matter if I ever marry again or not, that is the person I long to be.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 5:21:27 PM
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John_O
Posts: 8015
Joined: 9/5/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: followtheLeader
quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
People don't just fall into adultery (for example) they toy with it and entertain it and finally convince themselves that it's OK. If you never allow yourslef to play with fire you never get burned. KWIM?
As a blanket state this is incorrect.
Why would a Christian just suddenly decide to commit adultery? They wouldn't. It goes against every thing they stand for and have allied themselves with.
If a person is right with Jesus and trying to live as Jesus commands us, they would flee even the beginnings of an opportunity to sin. It's when we entertain it that we get into trouble.
It's a long process, not an overnight decision. (Barring drugs or other major trauma, but that leads to another discussion entirely)
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 5:27:48 PM
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Prairiehiker
Posts: 3264
Status: offline
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When I was a wee bit younger, I had a list a mile long though I didn't articulate it in words. I mean, I would write off a person at first glance, so I know that I had a mental list. As I got a bit older, I moved from the superficial qualities, to charater attributes of the person. But even then, my list were not influence by my Christian believe. THey were mostly based on what I thought would provide me with the security that I need to survive in this world and I found my security through status and image.
Now as I got even older, I am making a list of what God wants me to be and diligently seeking to be that person. He's introducing me to how I was/am designed. Looking back, my list in the past was about trying to create an identity based on what a man can give me as opposed to what I can offer a man. I still have a list, and some are still superficial, but for the most part, I look for compatibility in four areas: Spiritual, physical, emotional, and intellectual. There has to be strong connection in all those four areas. ALso, I have to have a great deal of respect and admiration for the man I'm going to spend the rest of my life with. That's what makes a relationship so much sweeter.
Now, where do I find him? I don't have a clue. This is where faith, prayer and action comes in.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 6:05:52 PM
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WaitingforBoaz
Posts: 4235
Joined: 2/11/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
People don't just fall into adultery (for example) they toy with it and entertain it and finally convince themselves that it's OK. If you never allow yourslef to play with fire you never get burned. KWIM?
As a blanket state this is incorrect.
quote:
Why would a Christian just suddenly decide to commit adultery? They wouldn't. It goes against every thing they stand for and have allied themselves with.
Because we are sinners and we have an enemy who would like nothing better than to trip us up and make us sin(separate us from God)
Paul says it best in Romans 7
15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature.[c] For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing.
quote:
If a person is right with Jesus and trying to live as Jesus commands us, they would flee even the beginnings of an opportunity to sin. It's when we entertain it that we get into trouble.
I did not say that this is never the case, I am just saying that it is not always the case. I am not supposing this to be true, it is true. We used to do counciling and I have personal experiences discussing in detail some of these situations. There may be other sin that leads up to the deed, porn etc. and they certainly made the choice to enter a situation where it could happen, but to make a blanket statement that if someone has done it, it was premeditated is just wrong.
I hate it either way. I just don't like blanket statements. Every situation is different.
quote:
It's a long process, not an overnight decision. (Barring drugs or other major trauma, but that leads to another discussion entirely)
Again, I disagree. Everything cannot be put into nice neat little boxes. Every situation is as unique as the people involved.
I'm just wondering why it is that you feel that someone would have to be doing drugs or clubbed it the head to sin. That's not what my Bible says.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 6:24:10 PM
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shemaromans
Posts: 3752
Joined: 3/30/2007
Status: offline
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I don't want to speak for John, but I understand what he's saying. If we're Christians and committed to God, then we'll be ever alert for traps and snares. We'll remain in prayer and the Word. In essence, we'll be focused on God, striving to do His will with the help of the Spirit.
If we're doing these things, then we won't commit adultery. If we backslide and stray from these practices, then we open the door for sins such as adultery.
A husband and wife who take their vows seriously and place their trust and focus on God to help them honor their vows will pray together and do all the little things that will prevent something like adultery from happening. They'll remember to give sweet pecks on the forehead and cheek. They'll tease each other lovingly. They'll praise one another in front of other people. They'll keep the physical aspect of their marriage fun and exciting. They'll place each other above their own needs. They'll keep themselves out of situations that might lead to or even slightly suggest immorality. They'll...the list continues.
Adultery won't happen overnight. It won't be an "Oops! Didn't see that coming" error like something as simple as tripping over a pebble. Adultery for Christians develops over time. With intentional focus and love, husbands and wives can avoid the trappings.
_____________________________
"But as for me, it is good to be near God." Psalm 73:28
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 9:24:35 PM
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WaitingforBoaz
Posts: 4235
Joined: 2/11/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: shemaromans
I don't want to speak for John, but I understand what he's saying. If we're Christians and committed to God, then we'll be ever alert for traps and snares. We'll remain in prayer and the Word. In essence, we'll be focused on God, striving to do His will with the help of the Spirit.
If we're doing these things, then we won't commit adultery. If we backslide and stray from these practices, then we open the door for sins such as adultery.
A husband and wife who take their vows seriously and place their trust and focus on God to help them honor their vows will pray together and do all the little things that will prevent something like adultery from happening. They'll remember to give sweet pecks on the forehead and cheek. They'll tease each other lovingly. They'll praise one another in front of other people. They'll keep the physical aspect of their marriage fun and exciting. They'll place each other above their own needs. They'll keep themselves out of situations that might lead to or even slightly suggest immorality. They'll...the list continues.
Adultery won't happen overnight. It won't be an "Oops! Didn't see that coming" error like something as simple as tripping over a pebble. Adultery for Christians develops over time. With intentional focus and love, husbands and wives can avoid the trappings.
I get what he is saying also, and I agree with everything you have said about taking your vows seriously and doing everything possible to protect your marriage, I lived it, so I know it to be true, however, I disagree with the bolded statement.
Yes, they may have problems in their marriage, lack of communication, busyness, "no time" for intimacy etc, even a hardening of their heart towards God, that lead to the act of infidelity, However, the act can be a snare of the enemy, that happens in a moment of weakness and unplanned. (Sometimes the sinner is stunned, they thought it could never happen to them)
I never intend to sin, no Christian should but I do and so does everyone on this forum. (see scripture in my above post)Mine is not premeditated. Most aren't. But, sin is sin. We like to create our own levels of sin, there are certainly "levels" of consequences if you will, but sin amounts to the same thing, separation from God until repentance occurs.
I love that sig. that someone has about chasing after perfection and possibly finding excellence.
Christians need to strive towards excellence but understand that people are humans and they will fail, when they repent we need to welcome them back into the fold as a full fleged member of the body. If we set up this idea of only perfection in christianity I am afraid we may prevent some from coming back to the church, where they need to be for growth and accountability, so they can hopefully avoid the firey darts of the enemy next time.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 9:29:03 PM
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John_O
Posts: 8015
Joined: 9/5/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: followtheLeader
quote:
If a person is right with Jesus and trying to live as Jesus commands us, they would flee even the beginnings of an opportunity to sin. It's when we entertain it that we get into trouble.
I did not say that this is never the case, I am just saying that it is not always the case. I am not supposing this to be true, it is true. We used to do counciling and I have personal experiences discussing in detail some of these situations. There may be other sin that leads up to the deed, porn etc. and they certainly made the choice to enter a situation where it could happen, but to make a blanket statement that if someone has done it, it was premeditated is just wrong.
I hate it either way. I just don't like blanket statements. Every situation is different.
No one who is walking close to Jesus, in their word every day, trying their best to be Christlike, is just going to go out and commit adultery. There si always a compromise, another sin, that leads to it.
When M and I got married, we decided that our marriage was forever and that we would never break our vows. This was so ingrained into us that we never even allowed the use of the "d" word in our house. It was simply not an option. Likewise adultery was never an option. It was so not an option that it was never even considered. And if the thought came up it was met with revulsion no matter who was involved in the temptation. It just wasn't done.
quote:
quote:
It's a long process, not an overnight decision. (Barring drugs or other major trauma, but that leads to another discussion entirely)
Again, I disagree. Everything cannot be put into nice neat little boxes. Every situation is as unique as the people involved.
I refuse to believe that a blood bought, sold out for the Lord Christian can wake up one morning and fall into adultery. Surely the voice of the Holy Spirit screaming in their ear "DON"T DO THIS IT IS SIN!!!!!!" would jolt them out of the situation. (This is why I made the exemption originally for drugs and alcohol. get someone drugged/drunk enough and who knows what will happen.)
quote:
I'm just wondering why it is that you feel that someone would have to be doing drugs or clubbed it the head to sin. That's not what my Bible says.
Not to just any sin, but adultery, a sin that will rip their life, and the lives of their loved ones totally asunder. Why would anyone who loved another person cheat on that person? It's incomprehensible to me. Sex is all in the head and as long as you keep your head in the right place (Focused on Christ and your spouse) then how could you have sex with someone else?
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 9:31:35 PM
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John_O
Posts: 8015
Joined: 9/5/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: shemaromans
I don't want to speak for John, but I understand what he's saying. If we're Christians and committed to God, then we'll be ever alert for traps and snares. We'll remain in prayer and the Word. In essence, we'll be focused on God, striving to do His will with the help of the Spirit.
If we're doing these things, then we won't commit adultery. If we backslide and stray from these practices, then we open the door for sins such as adultery.
A husband and wife who take their vows seriously and place their trust and focus on God to help them honor their vows will pray together and do all the little things that will prevent something like adultery from happening. They'll remember to give sweet pecks on the forehead and cheek. They'll tease each other lovingly. They'll praise one another in front of other people. They'll keep the physical aspect of their marriage fun and exciting. They'll place each other above their own needs. They'll keep themselves out of situations that might lead to or even slightly suggest immorality. They'll...the list continues.
Adultery won't happen overnight. It won't be an "Oops! Didn't see that coming" error like something as simple as tripping over a pebble. Adultery for Christians develops over time. With intentional focus and love, husbands and wives can avoid the trappings.
Exactly right Shema! (and if you continue being right like this you can speak for me anytime.)
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 9:41:54 PM
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John_O
Posts: 8015
Joined: 9/5/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: followtheLeader
quote:
ORIGINAL: shemaromans
Adultery won't happen overnight. It won't be an "Oops! Didn't see that coming" error like something as simple as tripping over a pebble. Adultery for Christians develops over time. With intentional focus and love, husbands and wives can avoid the trappings.
however, I disagree with the bolded statement.
Yes, they may have problems in their marriage, lack of communication, busyness, "no time" for intimacy etc, even a hardening of their heart towards God, that lead to the act of infidelity, However, the act can be a snare of the enemy, that happens in a moment of weakness and unplanned. (Sometimes the sinner is stunned, they thought it could never happen to them)
I never intend to sin, no Christian should but I do and so does everyone on this forum. (see scripture in my above post)Mine is not premeditated. Most aren't. But, sin is sin. We like to create our own levels of sin, there are certainly "levels" of consequences if you will, but sin amounts to the same thing, separation from God until repentance occurs.
So in your first paragraph the person chose to toy with adultery by neglecting their marriage etc. So that adultery didn't just happen, it developed over time.
Let me take this more basic. Why was a married person alone with a person of the opposite sex who is not their spouse? Why did they put themselves into that situation in the first place? Why did they let themselves become so familiar with this other person as to develop feelings for them? When we are married we need to reserve our heart, our whole heart, for our spouse. There can be no room for others of the opposite sex there. To let others in is just flirting with disaster.
Now this doesn't mean that we can't minister to others, just make sure our spouse is involved in it. No where in teh bible does it tell married men to minister to women other than their wives (in a one-on-one situation). It tells the older women to train up the younger women
quote:
I love that sig. that someone has about chasing after perfection and possibly finding excellence.
Christians need to strive towards excellence but understand that people are humans and they will fail, when they repent we need to welcome them back into the fold as a full fleged member of the body. If we set up this idea of only perfection in christianity I am afraid we may prevent some from coming back to the church, where they need to be for growth and accountability, so they can hopefully avoid the firey darts of the enemy next time.
Perfection is unachievable. Everyone sins and every sin has the same eternal consequences (but temporal consequences differ widely). Repentance brings everyone back to Jesus (and the church)
But perhaps if we started acknowledging that every sin is the result of someone choosing to sin and that major sins (such as adultery) are built on a foundation of minor sins (such as neglecting parts of a marriage) then we'd see less of the major sins as people would be more aware of how these things happen.
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Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 10:12:34 PM
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shemaromans
Posts: 3752
Joined: 3/30/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: followtheLeader
quote:
ORIGINAL: shemaromans
Adultery won't happen overnight. It won't be an "Oops! Didn't see that coming" error like something as simple as tripping over a pebble. Adultery for Christians develops over time. With intentional focus and love, husbands and wives can avoid the trappings.
I get what he is saying also, and I agree with everything you have said about taking your vows seriously and doing everything possible to protect your marriage, I lived it, so I know it to be true, however, I disagree with the bolded statement.
Yes, they may have problems in their marriage, lack of communication, busyness, "no time" for intimacy etc, even a hardening of their heart towards God, that lead to the act of infidelity, However, the act can be a snare of the enemy, that happens in a moment of weakness and unplanned. (Sometimes the sinner is stunned, they thought it could never happen to them)
I never intend to sin, no Christian should but I do and so does everyone on this forum. (see scripture in my above post)Mine is not premeditated. Most aren't. But, sin is sin. We like to create our own levels of sin, there are certainly "levels" of consequences if you will, but sin amounts to the same thing, separation from God until repentance occurs.
I love that sig. that someone has about chasing after perfection and possibly finding excellence.
Christians need to strive towards excellence but understand that people are humans and they will fail, when they repent we need to welcome them back into the fold as a full fleged member of the body. If we set up this idea of only perfection in christianity I am afraid we may prevent some from coming back to the church, where they need to be for growth and accountability, so they can hopefully avoid the firey darts of the enemy next time.
Not for one moment do I believe that I'm incapable of sinning, nor do I think that anyone else is either! I totally agree with you about that.
I also understand what you're saying, Pooh, but I think that you're talking about sin in general and I'm talking about adultery.
You quoted a wonderful verse, but Paul also wrote:
"The weapons we fight with are not the weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ."
2 Cor 10:4-5
If I pray this verse consistently, wear the armor of God, and intentionally place safeguards in my life, adultery won't sneak up on me. If you're right (hypothetically speaking) and a situation does arise that presents an opportunity to commit adultery, without hesitation I'll be Joseph fleeing from Potiphar's wife.
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"But as for me, it is good to be near God." Psalm 73:28
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 10:15:01 PM
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shemaromans
Posts: 3752
Joined: 3/30/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
Exactly right Shema! (and if you continue being right like this you can speak for me anytime.)
Speaking for John, green beans are one of the best vegetables in existence, which is a huge claim considering how delicious almost all vegetables are. 
_____________________________
"But as for me, it is good to be near God." Psalm 73:28
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RE: To list or not to list.... - Actual list - 3/30/2008 10:53:07 PM
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WaitingforBoaz
Posts: 4235
Joined: 2/11/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
If a person is right with Jesus and trying to live as Jesus commands us, they would flee even the beginnings of an opportunity to sin. It's when we entertain it that we get into trouble.
quote:
ORIGINAL: followtheLeader
I did not say that this is never the case, I am just saying that it is not always the case. I am not supposing this to be true, it is true. We used to do counciling and I have personal experiences discussing in detail some of these situations. There may be other sin that leads up to the deed, porn etc. and they certainly made the choice to enter a situation where it could happen, but to make a blanket statement that if someone has done it, it was premeditated is just wrong.
I hate divorce either way. I just don't like blanket statements. Every situation is different.
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ORIGINAL: John_O
No one who is walking close to Jesus, in their word every day, trying their best to be Christlike, is just going to go out and commit adultery. There si always a compromise, another sin, that leads to it.
This is exactly what I said in my other post.
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ORIGINAL: John_O
When M and I got married, we decided that our marriage was forever and that we would never break our vows. This was so ingrained into us that we never even allowed the use of the "d" word in our house. It was simply not an option. Likewise adultery was never an option. It was so not an option that it was never even considered. And if the thought came up it was met with revulsion no matter who was involved in the temptation. It just wasn't done.
It's a long process, not an overnight decision. (Barring drugs or other major trauma, but that leads to another discussion entirely)
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ORIGINAL: followtheLeader
Again, I disagree. Everything cannot be put into nice neat little boxes. Every situation is as unique as the people involved.
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ORIGINAL: John_O
I refuse to believe that a blood bought, sold out for the Lord Christian can wake up one morning and fall into adultery.
One who was in ministry, bearing fruit, demonstrating the fruit of the Spirit in their lives, yes, seen it. (However, only God truely knows the heart of a man)
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ORIGINAL: John_O
Surely the voice of the Holy Spirit screaming in their ear "DON"T DO THIS IT IS SIN!!!!!!" would jolt them out of the situation. (This is why I made the exemption originally for drugs and alcohol. get someone drugged/drunk enough and who knows what will happen.)
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ORIGINAL: followtheLeader I'm just wondering why it is that you feel that someone would have to be doing drugs or clubbed in the head to sin. That's not what my Bible says.
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ORIGINAL: John_O Not to just any sin, but adultery, a sin that will rip their life, and the lives of their loved ones totally asunder. Why would anyone who loved another person cheat on that person? It's incomprehensible to me. Sex is all in the head and as long as you keep your head in the right place (Focused on Christ and your spouse) then how could you have sex with someone else?
You almost made me sound pro-adultery. 
Your attitude towards adultery is exactly the one any christian who enters marriage should have. You described my marriage exactly, never say the D word, all kind of safety nets in place etc. to avoid the possiblilty of adultery.
Remember the question was not "Will John commit adultery? If you are IRL who you are on here I can't see it happening. My husband was the same way, I was blessed.
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ORIGINAL: John_O People don't just fall into adultery (for example) they toy with it and entertain it and finally convince themselves that it's OK.
^^This is where we disagree.
We sit next to people every Sunday in church that have or will commit adultery. They are pastors, music ministers, deacons, elders, child care workers and just your average Joe. Imperfect people. They are not sitting there planning their next sin. But they will sin. Churches are full of people trying to recover from adultery commited by their Christian spouses. Sad but true.
Edited to exchange the word it for divorce for clarity.
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"There are no accidents in the life of faith. In its music, the accidentals perfect the harmony." 
