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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/4/2008 10:50:55 AM
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sparkleingsnow
Posts: 3450
Joined: 1/9/2007
From: Payson, Arizona
Status: offline
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Praying 4given. I for one would like to know what happens. Please keep us updated.
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Bless the Lord, O my soul: and all that is
within me, bless his holy name.
Psalm 103:1
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/4/2008 11:00:23 AM
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rcjames
Posts: 4623
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 4given_1
I know how the vote was 2/3 or not was because the votes are not by ballot they are by show of hands and are recorded in the minutes at the time of the vote. So its not difficult to know how many voted how.
So the public vote was not sufficient to carry, but it carried; and nobody said anything or questioned the vote count, or ask for a recount?
a bunch of mamby pambies I say, and deserve what you get.
Thsnks
RC
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Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/5/2008 9:07:39 AM
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sparkleingsnow
Posts: 3450
Joined: 1/9/2007
From: Payson, Arizona
Status: offline
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quote:
Original: rcjames
So the public vote was not sufficient to carry, but it carried; and nobody said anything or questioned the vote count, or ask for a recount?
RC, you weren't there. You don't know what happened. What was or wasn't said or questioned.
quote:
a bunch of mamby pambies I say, and deserve what you get.
Can we respond in a loving way?!
< Message edited by sparkleingsnow -- 4/5/2008 9:31:59 AM >
_____________________________
Bless the Lord, O my soul: and all that is
within me, bless his holy name.
Psalm 103:1
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/5/2008 10:09:53 AM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1367
Joined: 1/27/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 4given_1
TMeeks, read up on your suggestions. Boy, does alot of this sound so very familiar to me! Makes me wonder, do these people have the same M.O. or what!! The financial part, the getting rid of those who do not agree with them or question them! Interesting reading though, I have wondered how are they (the church) doing now.
It has been years and it still has not fully recovered. In fact, I wouldn't say that it has gotten back to even 50% of it's past levels of achievement. Reputations take a lot of time to recover.
However, it is those who had the courage to speak out early that have turned out to have the highest respect and best reputations. Even those in the church that once fought them, now see them as noble and insightful.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/6/2008 3:02:20 PM
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4given_1
Posts: 11
Joined: 3/31/2008
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As anyone who has dealt with a PERSON such as this knows. It doesn't matter how much you question them....THEY are always right and NO ONE has the RIGHT to question THEM. Yes, he has beat down most of the people there.But I disagree with rc. NO church deserves what these people do to the congregations that they oversee (or try to OVERTAKE). And no, the association is going to be no help. Which is fine, we will have to take care of matters with the Lords help. I am sure it will take a while to get over this but we can overcome with the Lords help. Thanks for those who have given supportive advice, (and for those who think WE deserve what we are getting. Thank you too :)
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/6/2008 6:10:24 PM
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crankius
Posts: 4157
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: crankius
If your association is not much help, you might try to contact Peacemaker Ministries.
I'm re-posting this. If you and others are serious about helping your church be a healthy church, this is an excellent resource to use.
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Do not be overly righteous, Nor be overly wise: Why should you destroy yourself?
Ecclesiastes 7:16
IS CHURCH YOUR IDOL?
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/12/2008 7:50:15 AM
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stephengoswami
Posts: 31
Joined: 12/5/2007
Status: offline
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The evil of salaried pastors.
I would advice you to leave that dead church and join a church with a volunteer pastor, who rely on God only for his support. He will be surely guided by Holy spirit.
In the initial stages of Christianity there were no salaried pastors. Holy Spirit maintained them. They received spontaneous gifts which were reinvested in charity. They lived ascetically with few necessities.
But later Christian churches grew stronger in the worldly sense. Becoming organized and monolithic they began to dominate and intimidate by holy fear and greed. Luxury and pomp entered. They solicited money by dubious means to maintain the clergy. So reformation came to save. In the initial stage here also pastors relied on God. But the same thing happened later. So we now see pastors as paid servant of the congregation, rather to the moneyed among them. They are hired and fired by the later. So naturally these churches have very little spirituality and have become just Christian social organizations. But I am blessed to see humble churches pastured efficiently by unpaid pastors.
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/12/2008 9:44:23 AM
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BibleL7
Posts: 411
Joined: 2/1/2008
Status: online
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There are many churches that are lead well by paid Pastors as well. And it is Biblical to support a Pastor or elder who devotes time to teaching preaching and shepherding the flock. Just because a Pastor is unpaid does not mean that the church is efficiently run either. I have seen many on both ends and it is more a matter of if the Pastor is called and following the Lord on how a church congregation works or not. Would I say some Pastors should be paid or not paid well I would say that depends on the congregation the circumstances and the calling. Just because a Pastor is salaried does not mean he is not called and doing a good job or that he is just there for the money.
Just the opinion of a small town preacher
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/18/2008 9:56:33 AM
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hjemerson
Posts: 151
Joined: 3/4/2008
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Wow I have seen things like this in my past 30 years ,I Hope the church will over come, but the sad part is most will just go to another palce then after this man has runin the work and name of this church that many has worked for the Lord to build in the community He will just move on to another !These are the type of men that call them selfs pastor and give the world the people to judg the God given men the bad name! If a true background check had been done and the people contacted has been honest this could have saved a lot of heartg acke I have seek this as the old church people just wanted to get the man to move on they gave a good ref and so now he is some else problem! I relive a pastor or any paid church person should be on a one year plan . It would give every one a chance to know and see if this is truely a called person for the Lord or just in it for a Job!
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/18/2008 7:10:02 PM
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4given_1
Posts: 11
Joined: 3/31/2008
Status: offline
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Hello all. I thought I would give everyone an update on our situation. We had a meeting on Wednesday night and voted this man out of his position as pastor. He tried to put up an arguement, saying that we did not have the right, and so on, but he was defeated and that was it. SO.........word is now, that him and his five followers are starting their own church in a garage down the road. But yes, other churches should be honest with each other when they do checks. I know we certainly will, don't want anyone other church to have to go through this ordeal. I know what you are saying about volunteer pastors, my grandfather was a pastor for many years and would not accept pay for it. But I know there are good and bad whether they are paid or not. I also know that we will be VERY careful when we choose our next pastor. And yes the year by year thing is probably the way to go these days. I do know of a church here that does it that way, and now I know why. Thanks for all the advice and prayers and may God bless each of you.
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RE: Advice ............Please - 4/18/2008 10:31:03 PM
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BibleL7
Posts: 411
Joined: 2/1/2008
Status: online
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4given_1
Perhaps in your looking for a new pastor you might look to other local churches with similar beliefs, I dont know if you are in a denomination or not but with many Baptist churches they are in associations or conventions with other Baptist churches. Perhaps some of them might have assistant pastors or licensed ministers that would be able to help or even become the pastor. Most of the churches I have been associated with there are members that feel called to preach and if they are qualified the pastor will license them as ministers and have them serve in that position for some time. The Pastor teaches and guides them to be leaders. Also the Pastor has control over all his activities in the church. Thus licensing him the Pastor can also revoke or suspend the license. And if you know of a good Pastor in your area or neighboring towns that might have a trained minister that would be a good place to look or they might know of one.
Just the opinion of a small town preacher
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