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Diolectic -> RE: Does the Potter Make Some Pottery for Common Use? (4/26/2008 7:33:13 PM)
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ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHeGod moved Pharaoh to... not to let His people go, and to chase after His people... After He commanded him to let HIS people go.
God did not move Pharaoh to, God judged him by hardening his heart after he did it himself.
I've explained this a few times already, are you ignoring that?
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Satan did those to Job. And who controlled what happened? Satan? Who lifted the protection?
If you don't believe God didn't have a purpose behind all this why did He do it? For kicks? God always had boundries for satan.
All that God allowed satan to to was to proove to satan what God already said.
However, according to you, God made satan do all that he did becaus God is the ultimate cause of every thing and controls every thing and thought.
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Why do you malign God? Why do you renouce the fact He's in charge? So, you think God wants and causes all sin.
I beg you, do not attemt to console a greiving person who lost an unsaved one.
You would probly tell them that God wanted them in hell, He hated them before they were born.
God didn't want to save them and they are in hell because that is what they are created for.
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Do you purposfuly want to present a sadistic tyrant as the god you worship? Do you purposefully want to present a god that is really nothing more than heavenly bellhop awaiting the next order from what He created? Why do you think that is what I believe?
no one commands God to do anything. We only must submit to His commands(Act 17:30).
When we humble ourselves under Him, and repent, He will forgive us only if we ask Him to.
Then He will show us how to consistantly obey all His commands.
You don't deny that you think God is a sadiustic tyrant.
Hhmmm.
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So, you actualy think that God deceptivly manipulates by comanding one thing and wanting another? Exodus 10:20 But the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart, so that he would not let the children of Israel go. 1Sam 6:6 Why then do you harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had worked wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?
Here, this Scripture actually say that Pharaoh hardened his heart and that God didn't.
Why didn't this Scripture say that God did it?
PHARAOH HARDENED HIS OWN HEART FIRST...
If God hardened Pharaoh's heart, the Scripture would be specific about God doing the hardening as the Scriptures do.
1. And Pharaoh's heart grew hard (chazaq), and he did not heed
them, as the Lord had said. - Exo 7:13
2. So the Lord said to Moses: "Pharaoh's heart is hard (kabed); he
refuses to let the people go." - Exo 7:14
3. Then the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments; and
Pharaoh's heart grew hard (chazaq), and he did not heed them,
as the Lord had said. - Exo 7:22
4. But when Pharaoh saw that there was relief, he hardened (kabed)
his heart and did not heed them, as the Lord had said. - Exo 8:15
5. Then the magicians said to Pharaoh, "This is the finger of
God." But Pharaoh's heart grew hard (chazaq), and he did not
heed them, just as the Lord had said. - Exo 8:19
6. But Pharaoh hardened (kabed) his heart at this time also;
neither would he let the people go. - Exo 8:32
7. Then Pharaoh sent, and indeed, not even one of the livestock of
the Israelites was dead. But the heart of Pharaoh became hard
(kabed), and he did not let the people go. - Exo 9:7
THEN GOD HARDENED PHARAOH'S HEART...
-- Not until the sixth plague did God begin to harden Pharaoh's heart
1.[/B] But the Lord hardened (chazaq) the heart of Pharaoh; and he did
not heed them, just as the Lord had spoken to Moses. - Exo 9:12
2. Now the Lord said to Moses, "Go in to Pharaoh; for I have
hardened (kabed) his heart and the hearts of his servants, that
I may show these signs of Mine before him," - Exo 10:1
3. But the Lord hardened (chazaq) Pharaoh's heart, and he did not
let the children of Israel go.- Exo 10:20
4. But the Lord hardened (chazaq) Pharaoh's heart, and he would not let
them go.- Exo 10:27
5. So Moses and Aaron did all these wonders before Pharaoh; and
the Lord hardened (chazaq) Pharaoh's heart, and he did not let
the children of Israel go out of his land. - Exo 11:10
6. Then I will harden (chazaq) Pharaoh's heart, so that he will
pursue them; and I will gain honor over Pharaoh and over all
his army, that the Egyptians may know that I am the Lord.
- Exo 14:4
7. And the Lord hardened (chazaq) the heart of Pharaoh king of
Egypt, and he pursued the children of Israel; and the children
of Israel went out with boldness. - Exo 14:8
8. And I indeed will harden (chazaq) the hearts of the Egyptians,
and they shall follow them. So I will gain honor over Pharaoh
and over all his army, his chariots, and his horsemen. - Exo
14:17
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God is the animater of all creation, no one is a free agent, they are all pre-writen programs, pupets, robots...ect...(so to speek) that only do what is inevitably going to happen and take place because it is all set in to order by God's will. Do you believe that Satan can win? In other words, that God can lose? God is confident in His Own Sovereignty that He can give men control of their own choices and actions.
Futhermore, God looses souls to satan every day, however, in the end God is Triumphant!
God may loose battles, but HE will win the war.
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It clearly tells us that we are to volitionally purify our selves. From what does man purify himself? By obeying the command to repent(Act 17:30) and put their faith in HIS blood to cleans them from all sin.
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What does man have within himself to do such a thing? A will, concience, knowledge of right and wrong...ect...
An ability to obey the command!
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