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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/2/2008 11:46:22 PM
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OneOfHisJewels
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I haven't read the whole thread, but I believe beliefs like this are fruits of the lie that the Song of Solomon is about a God/man relationship. IT IS NOT. It is about a husband/wife relationship, and how to have one, and how to have a good one, and to make it clear that a physical relationship WITHIN marriage is to be celebrated and enjoyed. Not all of scripture is about God and salvation. That is the most important part, of course, but God does give us some of the Bible to show us how to live our lives here on earth. For example, the Bible tells us about storing up food in summer for the winter, and that's not a salvation issue, it's a common sense issue.
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And the Lord will continually guide you, and satisfy your desire in scorched places, and give strength to your bones; And you will be like a watered garden, And like a spring of water whose waters do not fail. Isaiah 58:11
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/3/2008 10:27:20 PM
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SD456
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bride48
While at times I certainly did make marriage an idol, I can assure you I didn't misunderstand the teaching. Oh, I wish I could type faster, so I could explain it all, but please trust me. It was one woman in partcular...who happened to be the head of the women's ministry. She is divorced, and claims Jesus is her Husband. A wonderful Christian man proposed to her once (the marriage would have allowed her to be a missionary in India, where she had always dreamed of ministering), but she refused him because Jesus was her Husband.
Throughout my engagement, she always admonished me that my true Bridegroom was Jesus. Only once did she offer valuable marriage advice. The rest of the time she talked about the Marriage Supper of the Lamb. Those who knew me better knew that, at that point in my life, I no longer idolized marriage. I think, subconsciously, she despised earthly marriage, and wanted me to remain single. She's hyper-spiritual, and wants to impose her hyper-spirituality on other women.
All of us can get a bit off somewhere sometimes. It sounds like she had more the mindset that a nun would have, though without being Catholic. In a spiritual sense Christ IS there husband or their husbandman. I can understand that. But perhaps she was offering help the only way that she knew how, which doesn't sound like it was very helpful. She was being a bit pushy in trying to get you to 'understand' things the way she understands them. And perhaps she has the gift of celibacy which made it easy or easier for her to turn down that marriage and truly has a calling to be single.
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/3/2008 10:30:49 PM
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SD456
Posts: 1502
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quote:
ORIGINAL: OneOfHisJewels
I haven't read the whole thread, but I believe beliefs like this are fruits of the lie that the Song of Solomon is about a God/man relationship. IT IS NOT. It is about a husband/wife relationship, and how to have one, and how to have a good one, and to make it clear that a physical relationship WITHIN marriage is to be celebrated and enjoyed. Not all of scripture is about God and salvation. That is the most important part, of course, but God does give us some of the Bible to show us how to live our lives here on earth. For example, the Bible tells us about storing up food in summer for the winter, and that's not a salvation issue, it's a common sense issue.
I believe the Song of Solomon is an Allegory about Christ and the church. I don't believe that's a lie from the enemy. If you read from the Geneva study bible from the 1500's, christians back then believed it to be an allegory also and the Geneva Study Bible goes through the SOS line by line and explains what each part of the allegory is relating to according to our relationship with Christ.
It's quite beautiful.
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http://reflectionsdeep.blogspot.com
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/4/2008 12:15:29 AM
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OneOfHisJewels
Posts: 1061
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From: California
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SD456
quote:
ORIGINAL: OneOfHisJewels
I haven't read the whole thread, but I believe beliefs like this are fruits of the lie that the Song of Solomon is about a God/man relationship. IT IS NOT. It is about a husband/wife relationship, and how to have one, and how to have a good one, and to make it clear that a physical relationship WITHIN marriage is to be celebrated and enjoyed. Not all of scripture is about God and salvation. That is the most important part, of course, but God does give us some of the Bible to show us how to live our lives here on earth. For example, the Bible tells us about storing up food in summer for the winter, and that's not a salvation issue, it's a common sense issue.
I believe the Song of Solomon is an Allegory about Christ and the church. I don't believe that's a lie from the enemy. If you read from the Geneva study bible from the 1500's, christians back then believed it to be an allegory also and the Geneva Study Bible goes through the SOS line by line and explains what each part of the allegory is relating to according to our relationship with Christ.
It's quite beautiful.
I disagree. People constantly try to say it is an allegory, because they are so squigged out that God could even acknowledge the sexual realm, but He does. After all, He DID create it. Yes, it's beautiful, and I can find you plenty of commentaries that don't see it as an allegory..maybe as the secondary purpose, but not the first. My pastor (who happens to be my dad) sees it the same way.
< Message edited by OneOfHisJewels -- 5/4/2008 7:46:22 PM >
_____________________________
And the Lord will continually guide you, and satisfy your desire in scorched places, and give strength to your bones; And you will be like a watered garden, And like a spring of water whose waters do not fail. Isaiah 58:11
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/4/2008 12:16:37 AM
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OneOfHisJewels
Posts: 1061
Joined: 8/9/2007
From: California
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SD456
quote:
ORIGINAL: bride48
While at times I certainly did make marriage an idol, I can assure you I didn't misunderstand the teaching. Oh, I wish I could type faster, so I could explain it all, but please trust me. It was one woman in partcular...who happened to be the head of the women's ministry. She is divorced, and claims Jesus is her Husband. A wonderful Christian man proposed to her once (the marriage would have allowed her to be a missionary in India, where she had always dreamed of ministering), but she refused him because Jesus was her Husband.
Throughout my engagement, she always admonished me that my true Bridegroom was Jesus. Only once did she offer valuable marriage advice. The rest of the time she talked about the Marriage Supper of the Lamb. Those who knew me better knew that, at that point in my life, I no longer idolized marriage. I think, subconsciously, she despised earthly marriage, and wanted me to remain single. She's hyper-spiritual, and wants to impose her hyper-spirituality on other women.
All of us can get a bit off somewhere sometimes. It sounds like she had more the mindset that a nun would have, though without being Catholic. In a spiritual sense Christ IS there husband or their husbandman. I can understand that. But perhaps she was offering help the only way that she knew how, which doesn't sound like it was very helpful. She was being a bit pushy in trying to get you to 'understand' things the way she understands them. And perhaps she has the gift of celibacy which made it easy or easier for her to turn down that marriage and truly has a calling to be single.
Bride, I think she was envious of you.
_____________________________
And the Lord will continually guide you, and satisfy your desire in scorched places, and give strength to your bones; And you will be like a watered garden, And like a spring of water whose waters do not fail. Isaiah 58:11
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/7/2008 1:02:49 PM
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THEREDCAPE
Posts: 28
Joined: 4/23/2008
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We need to point out that it is not just women doing the romanticizing of Christ. Men are doing this too.
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/8/2008 8:47:16 PM
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SD456
Posts: 1502
Joined: 8/6/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: OneOfHisJewels
quote:
ORIGINAL: SD456
quote:
ORIGINAL: OneOfHisJewels
I haven't read the whole thread, but I believe beliefs like this are fruits of the lie that the Song of Solomon is about a God/man relationship. IT IS NOT. It is about a husband/wife relationship, and how to have one, and how to have a good one, and to make it clear that a physical relationship WITHIN marriage is to be celebrated and enjoyed. Not all of scripture is about God and salvation. That is the most important part, of course, but God does give us some of the Bible to show us how to live our lives here on earth. For example, the Bible tells us about storing up food in summer for the winter, and that's not a salvation issue, it's a common sense issue.
I believe the Song of Solomon is an Allegory about Christ and the church. I don't believe that's a lie from the enemy. If you read from the Geneva study bible from the 1500's, christians back then believed it to be an allegory also and the Geneva Study Bible goes through the SOS line by line and explains what each part of the allegory is relating to according to our relationship with Christ.
It's quite beautiful.
I disagree. People constantly try to say it is an allegory, because they are so squigged out that God could even acknowledge the sexual realm, but He does. After all, He DID create it. Yes, it's beautiful, and I can find you plenty of commentaries that don't see it as an allegory..maybe as the secondary purpose, but not the first. My pastor (who happens to be my dad) sees it the same way.
And I can find just as many commentaries that say it is an allegory - but it also truly speaks about the relationship between two people. It is both.
_____________________________
MY BLOG
http://reflectionsdeep.blogspot.com
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/8/2008 8:48:39 PM
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SD456
Posts: 1502
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quote:
ORIGINAL: THEREDCAPE
We need to point out that it is not just women doing the romanticizing of Christ. Men are doing this too.
Redcape, can you tell me specifically which churches and denominations are teaching this? I've not seen or heard of any that do this.
Thanks,
Stace
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http://reflectionsdeep.blogspot.com
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/9/2008 11:29:38 AM
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Kath
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SD456
quote:
ORIGINAL: THEREDCAPE
We need to point out that it is not just women doing the romanticizing of Christ. Men are doing this too.
Redcape, can you tell me specifically which churches and denominations are teaching this? I've not seen or heard of any that do this.
Thanks,
Stace
Why would this teaching be restricted to females only? If the SoS is an allegory of Christ and the Church, are men not part of the Church, which is the Bride of Christ?
I know that sounds ridiculous but so does this whole "Jesus is my boyfriend" thing.
ETA: and what are men suppose to sing while the women are singing these "Jesus is my boyfriend" songs in church? Do they just stand there?
< Message edited by Kath -- 5/10/2008 12:58:29 AM >
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/9/2008 10:34:21 PM
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SD456
Posts: 1502
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I am wondering if RedCape who created the OP is still on the thread.
RedCape what church or denomination teaches this? Your OP said that it's prevalent or sounded like it was. I'm figuring you must have been at a church somewhere that teaches it? If not, where do you get the idea that this teaching is everywhere?
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MY BLOG
http://reflectionsdeep.blogspot.com
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/10/2008 12:41:18 AM
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Kath
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I found a few good articles about this Jesus is my boyfriend thing.
“Jesus is my boyfriend”
Why Men Hate Church
From the book Why Men Hate Going to Church
quote:
There are signals in the sanctuary. Let’s say a common working stiff named Nick visits your church. What’s the first thing Nick sees? Fresh flowers on the altar. Soft, cushiony pews with boxes of Kleenex underneath. Neutral carpet abutting lavender walls, adorned with quilted banners (or worse: Thomas Kinkade paintings). Honestly, how do we expect Nick to connect with God in a space that feels so feminine?
The signals keep coming during the service. Nick may be asked to hold hands with his neighbor. He may be asked to sing a love song to Christ, such as, “Lord, You’re Beautiful,” or “Jesus, I am so in love with You.” Someone may weep. Then Nick will have his 8-minute male attention span put to the test by a 30-minute sermon. When this torture test is finally over, Nick is invited to have a personal relationship with Jesus.
Let’s spend a moment on that last one: a personal relationship with Jesus. That phrase never appears in the Bible. Yet in the past 50 years it’s become the number one way the evangelical church describes the Christian walk. It’s turned the gospel into a puzzle for men, because most guys don’t think in terms of relationships. Let’s say Lenny approaches Nick and says, “Nick, would you like to have a personal relationship with me?” Yuck! Men don’t talk or think like this, yet we’ve wrapped the gospel in this man-repellent package.
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/12/2008 12:06:26 AM
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tenfour
Posts: 81
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I'm a man, and don't normally buy worship music. I got a Rebecca St. James CD as a gift.
When I listened to it, there is a song where she is singing "Jesus, I am so in love with You." As she sings, she is breathing deeply and audibly, in a passionate sort of way that to me seems to allude to sex or making out. Hearing her sing was actually a little bit of a turn-on. Not good for worship music, in my opinion.
Sorry if this offends any RSJ fans.
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/15/2008 7:39:48 PM
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CoeurdeLeon
Posts: 6910
Joined: 9/4/2005
From: Inside my head
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I came across something interesting in my reading on an unrelated subject.
Here is part of a song written by Hildegard of Bingen, a nun and abbess of the 12th century...
O sweetest lover, sweetest hugger,
help us keep our virginity.
We rise from dust ~
alas, alas, from Adam's guilt.
How very hard to hold out against
whatever tastes of the Apple;
thou, savior Christ, set us aright,
Ardently we long to follow thee.
O what a struggle it is for us, the wretched ones,
to imitate the king of angels,
spotless, innocent.
Still, we trust in thee ~
that thou wouldst find again the jewel in the filth.
Now do we call upon thee, spouse and comforter,
who redeemed us on the cross.
In thy blood we couple with thee
in betrothal, refusing a husband
and choosing, thee, Son of God.
O most beautiful figure,
O sweetest smell of longed-for delights,
always do we sigh for thee in tearful exile...
Apparently, this is an ongoing theme for unmarried women through the ages and not a modern phenomenon at all.
_____________________________
Life's a pleasure, if you don't weaken.
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/15/2008 9:24:54 PM
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stellaluna
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Love Hildegard! (You know, she created her own language. She was quite intelligent.)
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/15/2008 9:56:29 PM
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CoeurdeLeon
Posts: 6910
Joined: 9/4/2005
From: Inside my head
Status: online
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I knew she invented an alternate alphabet but not about the language (or would that be the same thing?). A pivotal and fascinating woman in history, certainly.
_____________________________
Life's a pleasure, if you don't weaken.
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/15/2008 11:48:10 PM
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gmc4Jesus
Posts: 101
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Torrance, California
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
I find that modern day worship music could often be as easily sung to one's girlfriend as to one's Savior.
I agree, but if you listen, there is a lot of the world's music that could be just as easily sung as a love song to Jesus.
Jesus is love, but not in an emotional or sexual manner. While we want to focus on how much He loves us we also want to recognize that when He needed to be, Jesus' love was more committed at directing people to God.
I would like to see more Christians focus on how much they love Him. Portraying Jesus in a romantic manner makes me think of some of the Hollywood heresies that have been around. I prefer to see Jesus as a loving Savior, but not as a romantic interest.
May God bless you as you focus on how much you love Jesus.
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Let's talk about Jesus, His life and teachings at the www.gettingtoknowjesus.org Gospel Study Forum.
Home of "Getting To Know Jesus", a complete Bible study on the life and teachings of Jesus.
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/16/2008 8:07:23 AM
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bluestone
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I would like to see more Christians focus on how much He loves us, and the obligation that implies.
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"Ginger Rogers did everything Fred Astaire did..and did it backwards and in heels!
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/16/2008 8:11:29 AM
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CoeurdeLeon
Posts: 6910
Joined: 9/4/2005
From: Inside my head
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bluestone
I would like to see more Christians focus on how much He loves us, and the obligation that implies.
Hear! Hear! Beautifully said!
_____________________________
Life's a pleasure, if you don't weaken.
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RE: Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner - 5/16/2008 8:48:28 AM
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P31W
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quote:
Portraying Our Lord in a romantic manner
I only see that type of stuff when I watch or read liberal scholars. Of course I don't veiw them as Christians rather as the anti-christ.
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