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RE: Getting Others Off the Pew and Into Ministry - 5/5/2008 10:30:05 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3316
Joined: 4/11/2005
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I am on a soapbox this morning (sigh) friends forgive me this is not directed at anyone in a personal way. We have connection (small groups) Sunday at 5 pm. My husband and two others, a mother and daughter help do the childrens group. The mom of the group had a meeting this weekend for work, which is what she had to do, and I knew her daughter would not show up. I was right, daughter called about thirty minutes before it was time to leave, saying " family unexpectedly showed up". We had two parents who signed up to help this week. They did a no show, as expected., All the parents knew it was just my husband and I, with a large group of horrible ( last night for some odd reason) acting kids from ages 3-12. We did mothers day gifts, because we are not meeting next week. We did cards with purple Bingo daubbers making grapes saying " I love you bunches", and and pot holders with about a "mothers hands" written on the bottom of potholder from proverbs 31, and the children put their hand prints on the pot holders, and dated them. I am telling you all this, because we had two stations going, and two projects. The twelve year olds helped as did my oldest DD, my husband got out of her class to help.
It was so frusturating, the parents, and sign up people were in various classess playing games, having parties and such. I love what I do, my husband does it because, though it is not his calling, he steps up. If we did not have the kids, on Sunday nights, then there would be no small groups.
My husband is an elder, and adult teacher,and I know he missess teaching, he is excellent but, though it is no his calling he does what is needed. I will given be an anology of this, why something that is not your calling can still be Gods will. I was watching CNN last week, there was a story on a little dog, nursing a group of kittens, they started with three, and added six more, the little dog looked weary, but she cleaned, fed, and nutured the baby kittens anyway. The kicker is she has been adopted by a family, but has to nurse the kittens before she can go to her new home. This is how I see my husband, and what the Lord is asking him to do right now, is to step up, and do what is not his cup of tea, An as needed situation. My soapbox is this go where there is a need, if at all possible, even helping on a once a month basis, and others rotate with you. There are those making it possible for those who pew sit, so with gratitude and love, lend a helping hand. I am sure, even like th, crafts we did last night, the most untalented, unartsy person could have helped with. OK light is off the soap box. 
< Message edited by lightshineon -- 5/5/2008 10:37:17 AM >
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Getting Others Off the Pew and Into Ministry - 5/7/2008 12:54:30 AM
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Dakotasunbeam
Posts: 1178
Joined: 6/2/2005
From: Midwest USA
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Thanks elliemaejune!
quote:
ORIGINAL: elliemaejune
quote:
ORIGINAL: Dakotasunbeam
Get rid of the pews.
 Good idea!
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RE: Getting Others Off the Pew and Into Ministry - 5/7/2008 12:58:39 AM
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Dakotasunbeam
Posts: 1178
Joined: 6/2/2005
From: Midwest USA
Status: offline
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Kinda going back to my original post, I think its kinda funny when we (or those in "leadership") ask, "What can we do to get others off of the pews." In all seriousness, why are there pews? You've literally separated the body of christ into two functions, feeders and eaters. Sitters and standers. When EVERYONE should be waiting on his/her brother as needed. Literally, the pews need to be gotten rid of. People need to look each other in the face and communicate, share, give, bless, pray together. You cannot get people OFF of the pews, if you tell them that is where they are supposed to be. Church NEEDS to be revamped into something FUNCTIONAL. The way it is currently set up, there should be NO confusion as to why MORE people are not involved. It's evident.
Bless you!
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RE: Getting Others Off the Pew and Into Ministry - 5/9/2008 8:41:46 AM
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dd964vet
Posts: 12
Joined: 8/2/2007
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Our church has an approach that seems to work fairly well. In addition to teaching on the topic of sevice to each other and the community, the leadership needs to take a firm stance on not allowing "the few" to become over involved. If you notice that one of your flock is becoming a human doing rather than a human being, tell them to cut back. ( this applies to the senior leaders as well). If this means that some things are left undone for now, so be it. Burnt out leaders inspre no one.
Second, "If we can't do something well, then we will do it badly" and many times those who DO have the giftings for the endeavor will step forward and "rescue" us. A little manipulative, but I'm ok with it anyway.
Finally- Our standard is not efficacy,it is faithfulness. If God can raise up stones to be Sons of Abraham, then he can raise up workers for the harvest; but it is He who does the raiseing.
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RE: Getting Others Off the Pew and Into Ministry - 5/9/2008 8:51:36 AM
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dd964vet
Posts: 12
Joined: 8/2/2007
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An additional note; I am one of those people who struggles with the attitude that I must do everything myself. Recently it occured to me that at the root of this attitude is my lack of faith. If our expectations of what God can do is a measure of the status of our faith, the my attitude is a reflection that I must "do" because I expect God to do nothing.
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RE: Getting Others Off the Pew and Into Ministry - 5/10/2008 1:14:42 AM
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woodwind228
Posts: 111
Joined: 5/8/2008
From: Atlanta
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Well, here's a little bit of a different perspective. Realizing that some people are just lazy and unwilling to participate or be motivated, there may be other issues to think about as well.
Serving is huge, of course. But I think some people have no idea what they could possibly do. Maybe they don't feel "qualified" to do something. Or maybe they weren't specifically asked to do something. Yeah, it sounds kinda petty but some people are just that way. So......maybe your leaders could focus on teaching people about their spiritual gifts. There's a great book that I've been reading called, "Discovering Your God-Given Gifts". The authors (Don & Katie Fortune) talk about 3 types of spiritual gifts: manifestation gifts (supernatural manifestations of the Holy Spirit at work through a believer); ministry gifts (gifts used to equip the body of Christ); and motivational gifts (these are gifts to be employed to benefit one another - these are gifts we possess). The book focuses on the motivational gifts. The book has chapters describing the 7 motivational gifts and a self-test, chapters describing what that particular gift needs to be careful of (e.g. the administrator needs to be careful not to be judgmental), and chapters talking about the characters in the Bible with that particular gift. It also has tests to determine gifts in children and teens.
If people understand where God has gifted them, then perhaps it will be easier to see how they may be able to use their gift in serving in the church (and elsewhere). Who knows, maybe they'll even get motivated to get out of those pews.
Regarding the older generation though, some people do not/cannot drive after dark or in inclement weather. I don't see very many older folks at church outside of Sunday morning. And there's the handicapped that may have difficulty getting around much. Even still, depending on the different ministries your church may be involved in, there really should be something for everyone if they think hard enough.
Anyhoo...my 2 cents for what it's worth.
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RE: Getting Others Off the Pew and Into Ministry - 5/12/2008 12:17:59 PM
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pstrdebi
Posts: 192
Joined: 4/28/2008
From: So. Oregon, by way of So. Cal.
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
you have fifteen? wow. just kidding, I feel your pain, I do not understand it either.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Dakotasunbeam
Get rid of the pews.
HA!!!! 
quote:
ORIGINAL: BibleL7
First Drop the drama most churches did fine without that for years.
As for Drama I don't see where it was used in any of the early churches nor do I find it recommended in the Scriptures.
Paul discussed a couple of ways the word was being preached in Phil 1:18. Although not contextually the same, I believe the idea can be applied here. "What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is preached; and in this I rejoice, yes, and will rejoice."
Also in Colossi ans 3:17 it says, "And whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through Him."
God is the Creator of creation, creating and creators... He instilled in us... In His Image... His creativity.
quote:
ORIGINAL: FroMan
If you have success stories, I'd also like to hear them. How did you do it? Knowing that it can be done is uplifting.
OK... here is something that has been used and has been very successful in a very similar situation (nearly the same actually).
First identify your needs. I'm sure you've done this, however list them... Sunday school teachers, worship team, whatever...
Then, get out your church directory or a list of the members. Sit down with one or two others (in leadership) and start making notes about each person or couple. ie: Sam Jones... used to be a baseball coach, has grand kids, loves nature, hiking, etc. Go down the list highlighting each of their talents, jobs or past endeavors.
This gives you a base to work with. As you go through the list you will surely be eliminating some for whatever reasons... and others you will be identifying as prime "targets" (don't call them that... I'm just kidding!  )
Then you meet with each of these people individually. (Takes time... but the outcome can be good). Make it a personal meeting... a lunch or meet for coffee, etc. When you meet with them, tell them how important they are... how their wisdom and experience is so needed in the XYZ area or ministry. Ask them questions... "how do you do this?" "What would you do?" "Show me..." "Teach me...". (Even if you know all the answers... or think you do... ask them anyway, and just let them talk without inputting your own ideas. They need to know you care about what they are saying.)
What I have found is that the older generation has been burned out by exactly what is taking place in the church now... they were the same 15 people. They did all the work and grew weary. OR... no-one ever showed their appreciation to them... OR... they were used at one time because they were younger, and now they no longer feel needed or that they have anything to give. When we make them feel needed, it boosts their moral... their confidence.
When you start asking Sam Jones about all of his experiences and abilities... and you ask him questions about how Awana's or Royal Rangers or whatever, should be run... what he would do different... You are making him a part of it... involving him.
Then you tell him your demise.... "We are really struggling in this area Sam, do you think there is any way that you could come along side of us and teach us some of the things we've talked about? If you could just commit for a short while, I'm positive you could make a difference... we need you."
When Sam agrees, make a plan... and in that plan... if he can only commit for 6 months, decide that he will help to find another person to train up under him. This is a part of discipleship that is forgotten about. Discipleship carries into every part of the ministry.
After you have a group to work with... have a dinner or some function to outline your major goals, etc. and then... periodically have an "appreciation function." Invite all of your workers to a luncheon or potluck and show them how much you appreciate all that they do. Shower them with love and they will shower you back.
This has worked. Like I said, it takes time... meeting with each person. However, it can be a successful endeavor.
Good luck... and blessings... 
Pastor Debi
_____________________________
"For in Him we live and move and have our being..." Acts 17:28a
http://www.therockfellowship.org
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RE: Getting Others Off the Pew and Into Ministry - 5/14/2008 2:40:18 AM
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BibleL7
Posts: 247
Joined: 2/1/2008
Status: offline
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Perhaps I have not properly communicated my post.
First I was replying to the original post that said 15 people are doing all the work in the church. This is not good for those 15 will be burned out and then none will be left but the pastor. The reason I first said Drop the Drama for it is not biblical is simply it is something added to what the church should be and in having it it detracts from other ministries if you only have 15 people. Sure things can be done with people gifted to help in such ministries but if they are also doing other ministries then it hurts all ministries involved. If there is a call for a ministry then there should be members willing to participate. With a minimum of people involved in activities there should also be a minimum of ministry.
The basics we are to do is discipling others teaching them the Word of God and helping them and encouraging them to do the ministry. Sorry if you all disagree but I feel the most important part of church is the basic Worship and praise and preaching of the Word. This is where those 15 people are needed most. The leaders of the church should not be doing too many ministries Discipling is very work intensive and not something one person should be doing for over 50 people and if they are doing so with more than 5 people then they should not be involved in other ministries unless those he is discipling are involved in the ministry.
I have not found anything in the Scriptures that say the church is to be involved in so many ministries or activities. They are commanded to disciple others and to praise and worship the Lord. If you can show me anywhere in Scripture that says we are to do more as a body please let me know. The leadership is to equip the saints for the work of the ministry. The individual believers should be serving others and spreading the Gospel. As for the feeding of hungry, visiting the sick or jailed, clothing the naked, the leadership is not given this responsibility the entirety of the saints, each having a part to play.
Paul refers to the church as the body of Christ. He uses things like the eye cant say because he is not a hand the eye can not say I am not of the body, sorry dont have exact quotes I dont have bible program open. In the same manner that the eye is not the ear or mouth the eye should not be trying to do the work of the ear or mouth. If there is no hand then there can not be the gripping or holding, so if the hand is sitting in a pew and not doing the job of the hand then the eye should not try to do the job of the hand it just does not get done. For if the eye is doing the job of the hand, arm, foot then the eye is not doing what the eye should be doing and is meant to do.
The Holy Spirit gifts with varying gifts to the various members so that the members can work together in building up the church and glorifying Christ. Therefore I was simply saying that if there are more than 15 members than more than 15 members should be participating. If there are not people gifted for the ministry in the congregation the the congregation should pray the Lord send gifted people. If the body is lame it suffers.
Yes it is good to have the congregation participating together in other ministries to serve the community, teach Sunday school, have events. But if there are not people willing to do the ministry then the ministry is not needed and should not be done. And as for taking care of children during services or events if there is not sufficient staffing to do the job well then the children should be with the parents. You can say that this does not seem fair or loving but parents are responsible for raising their children. If they wish to do activities without the children then they need to share in responsibility for seeing the children are looked after. Such as a few of them taking turns looking to the children, and if there are older teens in the church they can also help look after the younger ones with adult supervision. And dont tell me that teens should be having fun instead of learning to be responsible. Learning to be responsible is how teens mature into adults. If this hurts feelings then I am sorry for that but truth is truth and at times truth and love hurts.
The church is not called to be worldly but to be separate from the world and preach the Gospel to the world. We are not promised comfy lives once we come to know the Lord but are called to have joy in trials and tribulations. Sorry Dakota but I dont believe the pews are the problem yet the ones sitting in them and perhaps those behind the pulpit even more.
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