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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/11/2008 11:00:08 AM
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cow451
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ntech
To answer the original question here the answer is yes.
All things considered here the end times should be over in 2028.
Meaning they start when?
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/11/2008 12:56:54 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 3170
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: OKLAHOMA
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quote:
If not well my interpretation is in error somehow.
That's the right attitude. If we find something didn't go they way we
think it should, it's us, not the Scriptures.
The date setting is bad, but there is good in it at the same time.
When we find we are wrong, it causes us to study. Some just
twist everything to NOT admit they were wrong, but the honest
will honestly study to see why they were wrong.
I've studied end times for so many decades that my conclusion now
is that we will find we were all wrong when it plays out.
Lumped in the Post-Trib grouping, I say it could possibly be in the next
decade from any given point, but it may be another millennia. Even
another hundred years would put me in a position that it wouldn't matter. lol.
On the subject of "being ready." IF we are "doing" when He returns,
we will be "prepared." Many think they are prepared, yet they are not doing.
"When I return will I find faith?" Will He find anyone doing Kingdom Business.
Or professing a faith in a false doctrine?
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/11/2008 3:20:16 PM
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Ntech
Posts: 68
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: Ntech
To answer the original question here the answer is yes.
All things considered here the end times should be over in 2028.
Meaning they start when?
They started around 1948. The very first event of the end times is impossible to know exactly when it happened because according to Matthew 24 it would have been this event.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
However it is possible to know this event was fulfilled because a sucessive event has occured.
The rebirth of the nation of Israel. That is a known end time event predicted by a number of prophesies both directly and indirectly. So May 15 1948 4 PM is the date and time of this second event.
Also in Matthew 24 we are told to watch for the opening of the fig leafs. and we are told that the total length of the end times would fit into the time period of a generation. Psalms 90 defines a length of a generation as 70 to 80 years. Eighty years from 1948 is 2028. Also if the day of Jezreel is figured into this as taking 2000 years for the curse then 2000 years from the death of Christ falls approximatly 2025 to 2035. Between the 2 prophesies then 2025 to 2028 is the 3 years the prophesies overlap. And 2028 is the last possible date.
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/11/2008 3:32:30 PM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 5739
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quote:
They started around 1948.
Assuming, of course, that this is God's rebirth of Israel instead of the apparent, fabricated creation by man. If it isn't, then the whole house of cards falls and, as in other wasted atempts, everybody goes back to the newspaper to figure out God's detailed plan.
quote:
Psalms 90 defines a length of a generation as 70 to 80 years.
Remarkable... Psalm 90 gives the aprroximate lifespan of man - not the definition of "generation." More LaHayism/Lindsayism.
A "generation" - prior to the current wave of prophecy experts - has long been defined as roughly 20-30 years, accepted as the average period between the birth of parents and the birth of their offspring.
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/11/2008 3:48:34 PM
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DarleneSchreiber
Posts: 169
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
They started around 1948.
Assuming, of course, that this is God's rebirth of Israel instead of the apparent, fabricated creation by man. If it isn't, then the whole house of cards falls and, as in other wasted atempts, everybody goes back to the newspaper to figure out God's detailed plan.
quote:
Psalms 90 defines a length of a generation as 70 to 80 years.
Remarkable... Psalm 90 gives the aprroximate lifespan of man - not the definition of "generation." More LaHayism/Lindsayism.
A "generation" - prior to the current wave of prophecy experts - has long been defined as roughly 20-30 years, accepted as the average period between the birth of parents and the birth of their offspring.
Not that this has anything to do with the price of tea in China, nor do I know much about or have any loyalty to either man, but why do you dislike LaHaye and Lindsey so much? And I guess you'd lump Jerry Jenkins in there, too, since he partnered with LaHaye. Is there anything you agree with any of them on? I'm just curious...you use their names as adjectives so often and I almost always agree with what you say about issues. So I want to know! (Not to mention, your avatar is one of my heroes! The character, not the actor!)
If this needs to be another thread, so be it. It may make for interesting conversation! 
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/11/2008 4:07:59 PM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 5739
Joined: 4/11/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DarleneSchreiber
Not that this has anything to do with the price of tea in China, nor do I know much about or have any loyalty to either man, but why do you dislike LaHaye and Lindsey so much? And I guess you'd lump Jerry Jenkins in there, too, since he partnered with LaHaye. Is there anything you agree with any of them on? I'm just curious...you use their names as adjectives so often and I almost always agree with what you say about issues. So I want to know! (Not to mention, your avatar is one of my heroes! The character, not the actor!)
If this needs to be another thread, so be it. It may make for interesting conversation!
I began disagreeing with Lahaye's pop-theology back in the early 70s, before he made his foray into pop-eschatology. Anyone that is a serious about the Pre-Mil/Pre-trib view should be appalled at the things he allows in the Left Behind series (yes, I read all but The Glorious Appearing).
Hal Lindsay's pop-eschatology was just as bad as LaHaye.
I actually like Jerry B. Jenkins' fiction (aside from the LB Series). I enjoyed his Hometown Legend a lot (the book is way better than the movie, but the movie is pretty good too).
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/11/2008 5:57:17 PM
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earthless
Posts: 5307
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where bbq pigeons roast....
Status: online
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Brother Jimbo's posts in this thread are money...
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/12/2008 8:36:50 AM
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Biblefreak
Posts: 701
Joined: 8/10/2006
From: the spirit of God
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ntech
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: Ntech
To answer the original question here the answer is yes.
All things considered here the end times should be over in 2028.
Meaning they start when?
They started around 1948. The very first event of the end times is impossible to know exactly when it happened because according to Matthew 24 it would have been this event.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
However it is possible to know this event was fulfilled because a sucessive event has occured.
The rebirth of the nation of Israel. That is a known end time event predicted by a number of prophesies both directly and indirectly. So May 15 1948 4 PM is the date and time of this second event.
Also in Matthew 24 we are told to watch for the opening of the fig leafs. and we are told that the total length of the end times would fit into the time period of a generation. Psalms 90 defines a length of a generation as 70 to 80 years. Eighty years from 1948 is 2028. Also if the day of Jezreel is figured into this as taking 2000 years for the curse then 2000 years from the death of Christ falls approximatly 2025 to 2035. Between the 2 prophesies then 2025 to 2028 is the 3 years the prophesies overlap. And 2028 is the last possible date.
Going off this 2028 ideal............
The most important signs are the ones that relate to Israel because God uses the Jews throughout the Scriptures as His prophetic time clock. By this I mean that very often when the Lord is revealing an important event that will take place in the future, He will point to the Jewish people and state that when a certain thing happens to them, the important event will also occur.
A good example of this principle can be found in Daniel 9 in the famous "Seventy Weeks of Years" prophecy. The prophet tells us to watch for a decree to be issued that will authorize the rebuilding of Jerusalem. He then says that the Messiah will come sixty-nine weeks of years (483 years) after that decree is issued to the Jewish people.
There are two key prophecies which relate the return of Jesus to events that have occurred in Jewish history since 1948. These two events clearly established the period in which we are now living as the season of the Lord's return.
For those counting that would be 2028.
http://www.lamblion.com/articles/articles_second8.php
_____________________________
"I'm blessed, I must confess
My heart is pounding in my chest
Cause this love's the best
I'm just a love addict"
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/12/2008 11:36:54 AM
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cow451
Posts: 3879
Joined: 5/6/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ntech
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: Ntech
To answer the original question here the answer is yes.
All things considered here the end times should be over in 2028.
Meaning they start when?
They started around 1948. The very first event of the end times is impossible to know exactly when it happened because according to Matthew 24 it would have been this event.
Gotta give you credit. Unlike most dispensationalists, you are smart enough to push the date far enough out so that nobody will remember your projection in 15-20 years.
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Wenn Sie so intelligent sind, warum Sie hier sind?
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/12/2008 11:40:25 AM
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cow451
Posts: 3879
Joined: 5/6/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Lapidoth
quote:
If not well my interpretation is in error somehow.
That's the right attitude. If we find something didn't go they way we
think it should, it's us, not the Scriptures.
I have an acquaintence "prophecy expert" (in his own mind, anyway) that is coming up on his twentieth annual Rapture projection. He's missed it nineteen years running. Now, when he explains his miscalculation, he blames the ancient Jews for not being able to keep an accurate calendar, LOL.
_____________________________
Wenn Sie so intelligent sind, warum Sie hier sind?
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/12/2008 11:44:13 PM
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Ntech
Posts: 68
Joined: 5/3/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
They started around 1948.
Assuming, of course, that this is God's rebirth of Israel instead of the apparent, fabricated creation by man. If it isn't, then the whole house of cards falls and, as in other wasted atempts, everybody goes back to the newspaper to figure out God's detailed plan.
quote:
Psalms 90 defines a length of a generation as 70 to 80 years.
Remarkable... Psalm 90 gives the aprroximate lifespan of man - not the definition of "generation." More LaHayism/Lindsayism.
A "generation" - prior to the current wave of prophecy experts - has long been defined as roughly 20-30 years, accepted as the average period between the birth of parents and the birth of their offspring.
You have to look at the content of the verses in question to understant that Jesus is talking about the lifespan of man.
Matthew 24
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
Psalms 90
10 The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.
70 to 80 years appears to be the reference. Also the reference to the day of Jezreel and the 2000 year curse gives us another reference to act as a guide.
And the story of Matthew 27 can only be telling us the story of how and when this 2000 year curse was slapped on the earth.
And one last thing here. I figured out the proper name for the curse and why it was imposed. It's the curse of Malachi. And why was it imposed? For the death of Jesus Christ? Actually no. It was imposed for the death of John the Baptist.
Why? Read the verses. It would seem that John the Baptist was Elijah the prophet. Even though he denied it. And Herod killed him before he was able to fufill all of whatever mission he was here to do. That appears to be the reason the curse was imposed.
Malachi 4.
5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:
6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.
Would things have turned out differently if he had lived? I wonder.
< Message edited by Ntech -- 6/12/2008 11:54:25 PM >
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/16/2008 3:11:29 PM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 5739
Joined: 4/11/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ntech
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
They started around 1948.
Assuming, of course, that this is God's rebirth of Israel instead of the apparent, fabricated creation by man. If it isn't, then the whole house of cards falls and, as in other wasted atempts, everybody goes back to the newspaper to figure out God's detailed plan.
quote:
Psalms 90 defines a length of a generation as 70 to 80 years.
Remarkable... Psalm 90 gives the aprroximate lifespan of man - not the definition of "generation." More LaHayism/Lindsayism.
A "generation" - prior to the current wave of prophecy experts - has long been defined as roughly 20-30 years, accepted as the average period between the birth of parents and the birth of their offspring.
You have to look at the content of the verses in question to understant that Jesus is talking about the lifespan of man...
No, you are bending a definition to suit a premise that fall apart without doing so. The most you can stretch a "generatiom" is 30 years. After that, you're only kidding yourself and the gullible.
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/16/2008 3:44:05 PM
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LBolt
Posts: 788
Joined: 11/30/2007
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I'm with Lapidoth, let's just be prepared everyday and we won't have to worry. I do tend to believe that this "Middle East peace agreement" has some very key elements because it's dealing with divided the land of Israel... which is why I believe the U.S. is experiencing the atrocities we have been suffering lately. Again, let's wait and see and be about our Abba's business.
_____________________________
Wisdom is the principle thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding...she shall give to thine head an ornament of grace..---Proverbs 4:7,9
You mean there was grace in the Old Testament?!!!
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/16/2008 4:40:16 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 3170
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: OKLAHOMA
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lapidoth
quote:
If not well my interpretation is in error somehow.
That's the right attitude. If we find something didn't go they way we
think it should, it's us, not the Scriptures.
I have an acquaintence "prophecy expert" (in his own mind, anyway) that is coming up on his twentieth annual Rapture projection. He's missed it nineteen years running. Now, when he explains his miscalculation, he blames the ancient Jews for not being able to keep an accurate calendar, LOL.
LOL. That's the way it is isn't it?
19 misses out of 20? lol.
His predictions are false, but his record is perfect.
Blaming the ancient Jews don't cut it. This just shows man's ignorance.
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/17/2008 4:45:34 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3879
Joined: 5/6/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Lapidoth
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lapidoth
quote:
If not well my interpretation is in error somehow.
That's the right attitude. If we find something didn't go they way we
think it should, it's us, not the Scriptures.
I have an acquaintence "prophecy expert" (in his own mind, anyway) that is coming up on his twentieth annual Rapture projection. He's missed it nineteen years running. Now, when he explains his miscalculation, he blames the ancient Jews for not being able to keep an accurate calendar, LOL.
LOL. That's the way it is isn't it?
19 misses out of 20? lol.
His predictions are false, but his record is perfect.
Blaming the ancient Jews don't cut it. This just shows man's ignorance.
An update. Last week marked number twenty. I've been out of touch and didn't know his most recent revelation. But he's quieter about it now. I thought about getting a cake, but he wouldn't appreciate the humor. Was there a Jewish holiday recently? Usually he is focused on Jewish holidays.
BTW, he's actually an extremely smart man. But he became obsessed with Bible prophecy and seems to have developed this tunnel vision.
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Wenn Sie so intelligent sind, warum Sie hier sind?
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/17/2008 11:51:58 PM
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Ntech
Posts: 68
Joined: 5/3/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: Ntech
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
They started around 1948.
Assuming, of course, that this is God's rebirth of Israel instead of the apparent, fabricated creation by man. If it isn't, then the whole house of cards falls and, as in other wasted atempts, everybody goes back to the newspaper to figure out God's detailed plan.
quote:
Psalms 90 defines a length of a generation as 70 to 80 years.
Remarkable... Psalm 90 gives the aprroximate lifespan of man - not the definition of "generation." More LaHayism/Lindsayism.
A "generation" - prior to the current wave of prophecy experts - has long been defined as roughly 20-30 years, accepted as the average period between the birth of parents and the birth of their offspring.
You have to look at the content of the verses in question to understant that Jesus is talking about the lifespan of man...
No, you are bending a definition to suit a premise that fall apart without doing so. The most you can stretch a "generatiom" is 30 years. After that, you're only kidding yourself and the gullible.
So what is Jesus Christ trying to say here? Look at the verse again.
This generation shall not pass, until all these things are fulfilled.
And he is saying that in conjunction with the fig tree parable he just delivered. So the meaning is what? This "generation" as in group of people "shall not pass" will not die "until all these things are fulfilled" all events prophesied by the fig tree prophesy is complete.
So the meaning I get is that the group of people being born as of the event of the opening of the first fig leaf will still be around substantially by the time of the last predicted event.
"Generation" is being used to define a group of people not as a timespan. The timespan is their lifetime. Not their reproduction cycle.
And my guess is the "generation" is just over 60 years old at present.
< Message edited by Ntech -- 6/18/2008 12:01:00 AM >
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/18/2008 4:07:13 PM
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Coffee_Drinker
Posts: 92
Joined: 5/20/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Rev_22_4
The part about not worrying about it is not the attitude we are supposed to have. As I have already stated, Jesus is expecting us to know what's going on so we can prepare for it. He actually goes so far as to call us hypocrites for not being able to discern the signs of the times. We had better pay attention and understand them because if not, we will be deceived! Notice the first words out of Jesus' mouth when the disciples ask about the end of the world.
quote:
Matthew 24
3 ķAnd as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
Okay, so it is NOT possible to NOT worry about it yet be aware of what is happening around you? When one states they are "not going to worry about it" does not necessarily mean they are not going to "think" about it. That generally means they are going to "think" about something but they are not going to "worry" about something.
Does that mean someone who says thay are "not going to worry about it" has a "lazy" attitude towards the "prophecies" that God has given us? Jesus has told us to "look for him." God has given us his Holy Word. So... Why, I ask... should I worry about it?
I don't agree with certain individuals and personal beleifs that have been posted in this prophecy forum. But, I'm not going to be too awfully concerned with convincing someone of what "I" believe. Why? Why is it important? Isn't it more important to ask God for guidance and finding the opportunity to "tell" someone about the "free gift of God" which is Salvation through Jesus Christ, God's only Son?
Prophecy is great! Prophecy is really super! I love bible prophecy! I love Revelation, Daniel, Ezekiel, Thessolonians, and a few more. But, I would rather tell my unsaved brother-in-law about Jesus Christ than discuss the definition of the word "worry" with you. We are already saved by the grace of God by admitting we are sinners and accepting Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. So shining my rusty armor is not something I really relish to do.
God has plenty of PhD types on biblical prophecy out here. Pesonally, I like to listen to them. After all, they are more educated than I am. So be it Tim Lahaye, Jack Van Impe, or Hal Lindsey. Great! I'm not for one second going to think they are going to go to hell because they have a different interpretation of prophecy than the next. God's word tells you what you have to do to be saved. I don't recall seeing a checklist anywhere.
So... prophecy is really cool and awesome and this old boy just ain't going to worry about it.
Praise our living God!
_____________________________
Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/19/2008 12:08:03 AM
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1love1God1way
Posts: 2007
Joined: 5/16/2005
Status: offline
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If we are talking about how Jesus used the word "generation," then the definition given in Psalm 90 is completely out of date, given that generations change based upon lifespans and reproduction cycles, throughout different lands and different cultures.
_____________________________
-Ben-
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/20/2008 10:02:23 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 78
Joined: 4/29/2008
From: Terre Haute, IN
Status: offline
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Bill153,
In post # 6 you said that we (the church?) are the nation of Israel. I would definitely like to see you prove or reconcile that with Scripture. If that is the case, then why do we currently have a nation of Israel, which is definitely a fulfillment of prophecy? Not only that, but God's word says that His gifts are without repentance, and that He has no shadow of turning. For the NT Church to be the replacement of Israel, then God must have been just kidding around when H e gave Israel all the promises He gave her and the prophecies concerning her. I think it is blasphemous to say that God did not say what His word cleary says He said. You may want to rethink your theology, and use Scripture as your reference, not someone who claims to know the mind of God. We can, to an extent, know the mind of God, but such knowledge will NEVER contradict His word.
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/22/2008 8:45:25 PM
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plappy03
Posts: 17
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
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Howdy everybody, check out LambLion Ministries on this subject titled "Jesus is Coming Soon". Enclosed is many and many of prophecies about the end times in the bible including the Israel discussion that's going on. Check it out and hopefully it'll change skeptics minds on the soon return of Christ!!!!
http://lamblion.com/articles/articles_second8.php
Peace brothers and sisters in Christ!!!
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/22/2008 10:03:50 PM
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HisFish
Posts: 532
Joined: 8/3/2005
From: Rocky mountain way
Status: offline
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quote:
The date setting is bad, but there is good in it at the same time.
When we find we are wrong, it causes us to study. Some just
twist everything to NOT admit they were wrong, but the honest
will honestly study to see why they were wrong.
sorry to disagree with this but the history with all date setters is that they just go back and redo the math and set another date, some times with tragic results.
_____________________________
The theology of the present aims at the deification of man, but the truth of all time
magnifies God . C. H. Spurgeon
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/22/2008 10:09:15 PM
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HisFish
Posts: 532
Joined: 8/3/2005
From: Rocky mountain way
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: plappy03
Howdy everybody, check out LambLion Ministries on this subject titled "Jesus is Coming Soon". Enclosed is many and many of prophecies about the end times in the bible including the Israel discussion that's going on. Check it out and hopefully it'll change skeptics minds on the soon return of Christ!!!
http://lamblion.com/articles/articles_second8.php
This obsession with eschatology is at an unhealthy level these days, IMO.
< Message edited by HisFish -- 6/22/2008 10:16:14 PM >
_____________________________
The theology of the present aims at the deification of man, but the truth of all time
magnifies God . C. H. Spurgeon
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RE: is the time of Christ's return near? - 6/22/2008 11:10:59 PM
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plappy03
Posts: 17
Joined: 6/21/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: HisFish
quote:
The date setting is bad, but there is good in it at the same time.
When we find we are wrong, it causes us to study. Some just
twist everything to NOT admit they were wrong, but the honest
will honestly study to see why they were wrong.
sorry to disagree with this but the history with all date setters is that they just go back and redo the math and set another date, some times with tragic results.
If somebody sets a date and it doesn't come to pass. You should never listen to them again for they are not of God. Actually if I remember correctly there's a bible verse that says just that. Too tired to go look for it though.
_____________________________
Check out LambLion for Proof that Christ Jesus is coming soon!!!!
http://lamblion.com/articles/articles_second8.php
Phillipians 4:13
can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.
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