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ORIGINAL: JimboFletch

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ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way

No, they don't. They were very stout 5-point calvinists.

That's really strange to me. Most people criticize 5-Point Calvinists as not having enough rules to govern their lives and are more prone to enjoying life in Christ than the garden-variety Pentecostal, they just don't tend to have overly exuberant worship services.

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ORIGINAL: laura...

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* It teaches that they have the "whole truth" while SOME other organizations have some truth.
* The members still believe that those who leave that church will go to hell, and some of the preachers will still say so from the pulpit.

I would call it "cult".

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ORIGINAL: iwillfearnoevil

why don't you supply us with the answer for this particular chruch.

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ORIGINAL: JimboFletch

In brief and to me, Pentecostal is a denominational tag, like Baptist or Methodist.

Charismatic transcends denominations, it's anyone that believes in certain spiritual gifts largely not evident in non-pentecostal churches. Charismatics can belong to RCC, Baptist, Methodist, Presbyterian, or any other denomination.

WOF are cults that teach a servant or bellhop god whose job is to provide whatever is commanded. They believe Jesus saved us in order to make us happy and pampered.

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ORIGINAL: bluestone

So some Pentecostals believe that a second work of grace is necessary for Salvation, with a particular gift to prove it, others may think the second work of grace is optional? Or that a variety of gifts would be evident, not just a particular one?

How would that vary from Charismatics?

WOF people believe all that, plus you have to send in money to a ministry?

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ORIGINAL: OLEEguacamole

the term pentecostal used to be used more for all who felt what happened in acts during pentecost was still valid for today. the drift away from the term pentecostal to charismatic was i think to be differentiated from the rules based, doctrinally different pentecostal type churches.

wof is a subset of charismatic. wof is really a small deviation from charismatic thought. yes an important deviation, but there is so much in common with wof it often feels and sounds the same to long time charismatics.

as important as some of the false doctrines pointed out today are, it's not the center of what is heard. it's not jumping out to established believers because it's subtle and not heard that much. try telling a wof that their favorite preacher said something wrong doctrinally about Jesus. chances are they haven't heard it. these things are not a big focus in church meetings etc.

for over 40 years i have known many friends and family that are charismatics. some like many of the wof people. some like the elijah list stuff. most of the charismatics i know LOVE reading their bible. but in charsimatic churches preaching does not usually lean toward layering in basic doctrine and bible knowledge. it is geared more toward christian living.

it used to be sunday school was full of doctrine, bible memorizing and knowledge etc but these days sundayschool is more about christian living too and the future generations will not have the same foundation as their fathers and grandfathers.

this is not just a charismatic thing, but it is having a strong impact on the charismatic group IMO.

as for salvation issues, charismatics believe the grace gifts are a bonus so to speak. not salvic. granted some hardcore might wonder if you REALLY loved God if you didn't want that stuff, or think that your walk was like a soda that lacked carbonation, but still, not salvic. keep in mind, the other side has their opinions of the charismatic's walk too.

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ORIGINAL: windlover44

I think this is a good thread. I was brought up in a Fundamental faith background, but my Grandmother was definitely Spirit-filled, and I testify to that by her lifestyle. A blood-bought Saint, and walked the walk.
I believe by the grace of God that is why the Holy Spirit can influence my decisions.
Why this? Well, I've tasted what I believe is a well-rounded mixture of Assemblies of God...Charismatic, and Word of Faith. I think what I've learned is "Have we not One God and Father?"...& "It is he who works in us to will and do of His pleasure."
People believe in Pentecost...if we didn't, how could we believe the Bible is true...if we call Pentecost (ACTS 2) a lie, then we call God a liar. If we believe Pentecost, we can have charmisa [which in America if you have charisma you're usually a jubilant person..."The joy of the Lord is my strength."], and living Word of Faith people, well Hebrews 4:12 says "the Word of the Lord is quick, powerful, sharper than any two-edged sword, dividing joints and marrow, soul and spirit, and discerning the thoughts and intents of the heart." So, Word of Faith are people who pursue "the Living Word", as I was taught. Combine them properly, wouldn't that just be a living church? And if God didn't raise up things to challenge us and cause us to believe he is real, would we then "all grow unto a mature person, who is one in Christ?" Maybe we're just not looking at the big picture because we aren't accustomed to God doing something new. Well, the book of Isaiah says, "Behold, I will do a new thing...now it springs forth.", and if you're New Testament prone only, Hebrews teaches "Jesus Christ, the same yesterday, today, and forever.", which fully supports a living God doing a new thing in our day, who never changes, for if Christ truly came then He is He who was birthed from the same prophet who proclaimed "a new thing."
If God is God, then he can do anything, and if we understand and move in His love and obedience of His Word, then we are in living faith, and if we have One Lord, we will only have one Teacher, and if the Teacher is right, how can we argue, when we only have One Truth to follow?
Not just maybe he will raise up his bride, I think is the greater question...but the fact that He is preparing her and she is going to shine!

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ORIGINAL: M-Paul

Pentecostals are Christians who believe that the baptism of the Holy Spirit is evidenced by speaking in tongues, and other doctrine relating to experiencing the power of God as literally represented in the Bible.

Charismatics are 1. an extreme form of Pentecostalism; or 2. an experience of Pentecostal power within a congregation but originating outside of and extending beyond the supervision of a particular church government.

WOF is a movement that arose within Pentecostal circles, that created a new doctrine on how to experience the power of God by the words ones speaks, apparently under the influence of Christian Science teachings.

I am a Classical Pentecostal, meaning I believe in the theology as formulated and taught at the Azusa Street Revival, which is completely different than WOF. We emphasize that the power of God is experienced by emptying oneself of the ways of the world, and by denying the natural man, which makes greater room for receiving the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

These classifications are simple and basic, but understanding them to a large extent depends on whether a person just wants to understand them.

M-Paul

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My WoF church does teach basic doctrine and bible knowgledge.

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ORIGINAL: M-Paul

Pentecostals are Christians who believe that the baptism of the Holy Spirit is evidenced by speaking in tongues, and other doctrine relating to experiencing the power of God as literally represented in the Bible.

Charismatics are 1. an extreme form of Pentecostalism; or 2. an experience of Pentecostal power within a congregation but originating outside of and extending beyond the supervision of a particular church government.

WOF is a movement that arose within Pentecostal circles, that created a new doctrine on how to experience the power of God by the words ones speaks, apparently under the influence of Christian Science teachings.

I am a Classical Pentecostal, meaning I believe in the theology as formulated and taught at the Azusa Street Revival, which is completely different than WOF. We emphasize that the power of God is experienced by emptying oneself of the ways of the world, and by denying the natural man, which makes greater room for receiving the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

These classifications are simple and basic, but understanding them to a large extent depends on whether a person just wants to understand them.

M-Paul

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ORIGINAL: MrFribbles

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My WoF church does teach basic doctrine and bible knowgledge.

Just to make sure everyone's on the same page - how would you define the basic doctrines and bible knowledge?

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ORIGINAL: Definition www.apologeticsindex

Word-Faith Movement
Also known as "Name-in-Claim-it," "Health and Wealth Gospel," "Positive Confession," "Word of Faith," etc.

Word-Faith teachers owe their ancestry to groups like Christian Science, Swedenborgianism, Theosophy, Science of Mind, and New Thought--not to classical Pentecostalism. It reveals that at their very core, Word-Faith teachings are corrupt. Their undeniable derivation is cultish, not Christian. The sad truth is that the gospel proclaimed by the Word-Faith movement is not the gospel of the New Testament. Word-Faith doctrine is a mongrel system, a blend of mysticism, dualism, and gnosticism that borrows generously from the teachings of the metaphysical cults. The Word-Faith movement may be the most dangerous false system that has grown out of the charismatic movement so far, because so many charismatics are unsure of the finality of Scripture
John MacArthur, Charismatic Chaos, p. 290

There are many perculiar ideas and practices in the Faith theology, but what merits it the label of heresy are the following: 1) its deistic view of God, who must dance to men's attempts to manipulate the spiritual laws of the universe; 2) its demonic view of Christ, who was filled with "the Satanic nature" and must be "born again in hell; 3) its gnostic view of revelation, which demands denial of the physical senses and classifies Christians by their willingness to do so; and 4) its metaphysical view of salvation, which deifies man and spiritualizes the atonement, locating it in hell rather than on the cross, thereby subverting the crucial biblical belief that it is Christ's physical death and shed blood, which alone atone for sin. All four of these heresies may be accounted for by Kenyon's syncretism of methaphysical thought with traditional biblical doctrine"
D.R. McConnell, A Different Gospel