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ORIGINAL: Lizahana

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ORIGINAL: Sophie11

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ORIGINAL: Lizahana

FDR's TVA and CCC programs to name two.
Especially the CCC - where unemployed people were put to work building roads, soil conservation projects, etc. And I know it's coming...a big uproar at how awful you all think FDR was - but this is my opinion, I've argued with some and won't change my mind on this. And, though I am not of that generation, both of my parents spoke in high regard for FDR and his new deal - suprisingly so since my mom was a Republican all her life until 1984.

Thanks, Peace and God bless,

Weren't those programs more about job creation than anything else? How does that qualify as those times being the "good old days"?

I was asked to give an example of where the government stepped in and did provide a great service without pork-barrelling. CCC and TVA were - they trained unemployed people to build roads, parks, conservation programs for the US - the first 'workfare' programs.

Perhaps I misunderstood.

Peace and God bless,

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ORIGINAL: bzirk

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ORIGINAL: Lizahana

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ORIGINAL: bzirk

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And do you think it'd hurt them if they charged a little less? I don't think so - not at the rate they pay their lobbyists so they can whisper in the polictians ears to 'Stay the course' as it is right now with our broken healthcare system.

The reason they don't charge less is that the market forces have been limited. In other words, the market is very small. It is mostly some insurance companies, the federal government and a small minority of individuals who pay for insurance by themselves. If most people were paying for most of their medical care themselves, there would be more market forces bearing down on the cost of these goods. Someone selling something can only get what people can generally afford. But the government, and the insurance companies are keeping things jacked up. Look at the price of houses that are coming down. Why? Because the lenders finally quit artificially propping up the prices. That would happen if the government and employer provided insurance (done through a few major insurance companies) were to withdraw from the market. That's not going to happen, but it would be great if it did and in a way that's not quite as dramatic as the lenders withdrawing from the mortgage market as they have.

Here's something a lot of people don't know but need to realize. Insurance companies and drug companies and most big health care providers LOVE that the government is involved. That is a gravy train. They know that, and know that the governmet basically sets the price for healthcare, and it's high. To let market forces truly come in to play is not something they want. There are a few who do, and they are the minority -- mostly a minority of doctors but certainly no hopsitals or other providers.

Well, as I understand it - the private companies are the ones out of control. I know this first hand - they have so much money from overcharging everyone that they can go and buy out other clinics.

The clinic I go to use to be Milwaukee Medical - then it changed to Advanced Healthcare - but now Aurora bought it out; is tearing the whole buidling down (rather than re-using the exisiting building) and building another one right next to it!

Sorry - not buying it. Private insurance companies, clinics, hospitals overcharge so much they can buy politicians, they can buy out other private clinics.

And another thing that really gets my goat - I have asthma and get chronic bronchitis. I used to get this great 5-day generic antibioitic for a $7 co-pay. My pharmicist told me that the big pharmaceutical company sued the one that made the generic anti-biotic, so now I have to pay $40 copayment! This doesn't bother me too much, but can you imagine someone that didn't have health insurance?

And why can Mexico and Canada sell the medications for so much less than the US can? And why does the Whitehouse try to block people from wanting to buy these cheaper medications, when they are the very same medications?

Peace and God bless,

Lizahana,

I agree the private companies are out of control, but don't think that the government is not part of it. They are, and a big part. They have helped facilitate the private companies being out of control. What do you think happened to drug prices when the prescription drug program was put in place by medicare? Oh, I know drugs were already too high, and that mostly due to the fact that market forces with the insurance companies and drug cards have allowed people not to feel the pinch for years, and here we are. But I'm talking about the drug prices after the presciption drug program. They went up. Why? Because too many health care providers look at the government like a gravy train and yes, government regulation cots more. But I believe getting on the gravy train has more to do with it than the cost of regulation.

Did you know that 90+% of the hospitals in this country were truly run as non-profits when Medicare was signed into law, and by the early 70s the majority were in it for the money. I have some documentation buried in my basement that attests to this. I wish I could cite my source, but it won't hurt my feelings if you don't take my word for it. However, I know I can make these statements with confidence because the documentation is out there on the web to back it up.

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I apologize - I am just not understanding how the government is helping keeping the drug prices high - how are they? I have not read about this - could you provide links? Is the government telling the drug companies that they have to charge more? I'm not understanding...

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ORIGINAL: freakofnature

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However, I know some that do not. Some do not, like my neighbor, who started a local charity out of her own garage - ran it successfully for 20+ years. She gave so much to people in need. Now, with chronic back problems, she was dropped by her insurance company. She may have to either sell her house or take a 2nd mortgage to pay for her surgeries; or, just live with sometimes debilitating back pain.

Sad story... wow... well.. choices choices? Not the tax payers problem. The reality is that she has had options and this is the option she choses. KEY WORDS "CHOOSES and CHOICE." All that personal responsibility junk ya' know.

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She did not choose to be dropped by the insurance

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ORIGINAL: KatMack

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FDR's TVA and CCC programs to name two.

Ah, yes, two "marvelous" programs that many economics theorize actually helped to destroy jobs in the private sector and INCREASE unemployment during the depression.

--Kat

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ORIGINAL: Jeff_from_Kentucky

I am dead-set against government run health care. I am for universal coverage, meaning that everyone should have some type of health insurance, but I am against the government running the health-care system. The government can't run the things it is already responsible for (think Social Security) so why should we trust them to run our health care system?

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ORIGINAL: PhunkD

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ORIGINAL: Jeff_from_Kentucky

I am dead-set against government run health care. I am for universal coverage, meaning that everyone should have some type of health insurance, but I am against the government running the health-care system. The government can't run the things it is already responsible for (think Social Security) so why should we trust them to run our health care system?

Maybe we should elect people that CAN do these things.

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Isn't that what everyone has been trying to do though? It's not as easy as you make it sound.

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ORIGINAL: freakofnature

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Isn't that what everyone has been trying to do though? It's not as easy as you make it sound.

My grandfather used to tell me "Congressmen are nothing more then glorified village idots, as long as the village has it's idiot, the village will be respresented in Washingon."

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ORIGINAL: PhunkD

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ORIGINAL: Jeff_from_Kentucky

I am dead-set against government run health care. I am for universal coverage, meaning that everyone should have some type of health insurance, but I am against the government running the health-care system. The government can't run the things it is already responsible for (think Social Security) so why should we trust them to run our health care system?

Maybe we should elect people that CAN do these things.

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ORIGINAL: PhunkD

I would rather trust elected officials that I elect than a private company that is only looking out for the bottom line.

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But I can understand not wanting the gov't to run health care. I certainly do not trust the current administration to do much at all.

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When we elect a party that hates government, we should not expect them to govern well.

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But once upon a time, our government was able to build highways, parks, and bridges, as well as create a safety net for those in need. Once upon a time, our government kept us out of war when it could, and won a war when it had to. Once, as a people, we stood up, through our government to monopolies that took advantage of people.

Now, we have gotten so used to bad government that we don't think it can do anything.

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I still believe that a democratically elected government can do some good things, and it isn't too much of a challenge to provide health care that is accessible and affordable, while still maintaining a high quality of service.

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If anybody DOESN'T have enough faith in the American people to accomplish this, than I wouldn't vote for them!

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ORIGINAL: Lizahana

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ORIGINAL: PhunkD

I would rather trust elected officials that I elect than a private company that is only looking out for the bottom line.

But I can understand not wanting the gov't to run health care. I certainly do not trust the current administration to do much at all.

When we elect a party that hates government, we should not expect them to govern well.

But once upon a time, our government was able to build highways, parks, and bridges, as well as create a safety net for those in need. Once upon a time, our government kept us out of war when it could, and won a war when it had to. Once, as a people, we stood up, through our government to monopolies that took advantage of people.

Now, we have gotten so used to bad government that we don't think it can do anything.

I still believe that a democratically elected government can do some good things, and it isn't too much of a challenge to provide health care that is accessible and affordable, while still maintaining a high quality of service. If anybody DOESN'T have enough faith in the American people to accomplish this, than I wouldn't vote for them!

Agreed and very well said.

Currently in the US, we have privatized healthcare, and it is painfully obvious that it does not work.

I, myself, have excellent health insurance - thank God because I have asthma, chronic bronchitis, allergies. However, I know some that do not. Some do not, like my neighbor, who started a local charity out of her own garage - ran it successfully for 20+ years. She gave so much to people in need. Now, with chronic back problems, she was dropped by her insurance company. She may have to either sell her house or take a 2nd mortgage to pay for her surgeries; or, just live with sometimes debilitating back pain. This is wrong, and it is echoed all across our country - sadly, also involving children, also involving people in even more dire situations.

There has to be some help from the government for those without, because our current privatized health care system is plainly not working. I would gladly pay more taxes to help people like my neighbor - who gladly helped others when they were in need.

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ORIGINAL: Lizahana
Well, most people I know (I'm not a senior) do not have access to Medicare. My mother gets it, but has to supplement it with other insurance because it's not enough.

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And, I think PhunkD hit the nail on the head - we once did have a government that built great roads, parks - ie, provided great services with little or no political pork-barreling.

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I, like him, believe the government can do this again - only in the realm of health care.

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And I don't believe in a single payer system - I believe in more of a mixture of private, public help - much in the Obama is advocating.

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ORIGINAL: Lizahana


Well, as PhunkD pointed out, and I had almost forgotten, there was a time in our history when this was not the case. It's time to bring that back.

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ORIGINAL: relady

I was the only one thinking that. How smart is it to "hire" people who hate government to run it?

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I would gladly pay more taxes to help people like my neighbor - who gladly helped others when they were in need.

Ditto to that.

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ORIGINAL: Lizahana


Well, as I understand it - the private companies are the ones out of control. I know this first hand - they have so much money from overcharging everyone that they can go and buy out other clinics.

The clinic I go to use to be Milwaukee Medical - then it changed to Advanced Healthcare - but now Aurora bought it out; is tearing the whole buidling down (rather than re-using the exisiting building) and building another one right next to it!

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And why can Mexico and Canada sell the medications for so much less than the US can? And why does the Whitehouse try to block Americans from buying these cheaper medications from Canada and a host of other countries, when they are the very same medications?

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ORIGINAL: PhunkD

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ORIGINAL: freakofnature

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However, I know some that do not. Some do not, like my neighbor, who started a local charity out of her own garage - ran it successfully for 20+ years. She gave so much to people in need. Now, with chronic back problems, she was dropped by her insurance company. She may have to either sell her house or take a 2nd mortgage to pay for her surgeries; or, just live with sometimes debilitating back pain.

Sad story... wow... well.. choices choices? Not the tax payers problem. The reality is that she has had options and this is the option she choses. KEY WORDS "CHOOSES and CHOICE." All that personal responsibility junk ya' know.

maybe you didn't read the post, freak. She did not choose to be dropped by the insurance company, she had purchased insurance. She also did not choose to get sick.