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Covaan_Meshuga -> RE: Origins and Morality (6/30/2008 12:52:31 AM)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Abiyah
What some people don't seem to be able to understand is that we who celebrate Torah, and live Torah-observant lives, are not "under the Law." We live it for love of the L-rd but understand, and live out, that Torah never saved anyone. There is one salvation, only one, through only one Savior, and that one Savior is Messiah who live, died, and rose again for our salvation.
quote:
ORIGINAL: MrFribbles
Heh, trust me, I know you don't think observing the Law grants salvation. If that was my impression, I would be taking the subject much more seriously, because then it would literally be a dead-serious matter.
Okay. I just didn't want to broach this on any other level. Thank you.
So, since you asked, and I have no idea what you already know, understand, and connect regarding what I am going to write, I am going to write as though you have never even thought about this subject.
First of all, from the beginning of the Bible, the L-rd repeatedly has His prophet write about how He separated things. The land from the water, light from dark, etc., then later the godly from the ungodly, the general population through language confusion, Israel from Gentiles, the tribes within Israel, etc.
It is amazing how He demonstrated His intentions by separating, separating, separating, but He does nothing without deliberate purpose, in order to teach His people. Everything He does for population, for the eras, is with multiple purpose, because He is meticulous toward bringing forth His purpose in every generation.
So He Gave His instruction for life. Within it, he cautioned the people to separate the holy from the profane and the common and the profane things. The Tabernacle's area were separated by curtains, the dishes used there were separated from common dishes, as was the oil, the sacrifices, etc., the holy from the common and the profane. The Temple was separated by curtains and doors -- the holy from the common and the profane. The priests were separated from the people in their clothing: the common folk were not to mix wool and linen, because that was what the priests' garments were made from; the common people were not to try to reproduce the incense used in worship, etc.
Then, when people began to mix in the worship of the gods of the nations, G-d made specific rules for this, including not boiling a young goat in its mother's milk (Ex 23:19), don't round the corners of their beards, don't make other gods, etc.
Now, down to 1 Sam 15, which more specifically answers the question. Saul is told to bring nothing back from the battle, but he claims he did what the L-rd said, and the beasts are for sacrifice. He had a better idea than G-d: use the things of the wicked Amalekites to serve G-d. Then he says they really did do what the L-rd said, but the people (now) had wanted to use these things for G-d! But it won't work. Samuel says that obeying is first in G-d's sight, and rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, stubbornness as iniquity and idolatry.
Does the L-rd still require sacrifice here? Yes. But as in Isaiah and the Psalms, the sacrifice must be done from a heart separate unto G-d, using those beasts that were separated unto G-d. No mixture of the holy (set apart) and the common or profane.
Because G-d's intention, from the beginning, was to bring about Messiah, He also told the people not to mingle with those of other nations who were not following Him. When a Gentile chose to be part of the community in order to serve their G-d, they were to take on Israel's ways. A “mixed multitude” left Egypt with Israel, and that was fine, as long as they followed G-d’s rules. After all, the whole idea from the beginning was that G-d would bless not only the nation of Israel but also the Gentiles – that is clear throughout the Scriptures.
The idea was not so much to keep the physical seed of Israel pure but to keep the spiritual seed pure. But the psalmist wrote that Israel mixed with the nations and learned their ways (Ps 106:35). They were to be holy, sanctified unto the L-rd. They were not to learn the ways of the wicked. Other Scriptures that may be consulted are those around and including Lev 19:19 and chapter 21 and 22:2, 32; Deut 22:11.
For what reason did the sons of Eli die? For mixing the holy with the profane. What did Ezekiel decry in Eze 22:26? That the priests had mixed the holy with the profane. Ezekiel looked forward to the time when the holy would be separated from the profane (Eze 44:23).
So, now, Ephesians 4:17 - 24 from the NASB: So this I say, and affirm together with the Lord, that you walk no longer just as the Gentiles also walk, in the futility of their mind, 18 being darkened in their understanding, excluded from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them, because of the hardness of their heart; 19 and they, having become callous, have given themselves over to sensuality for the practice of every kind of impurity with greediness. 20 But you did not learn Christ in this way 21 if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught in Him, just as truth is in Jesus, 22 that, in reference to your former manner of life, you lay aside the old self, which is being corrupted in accordance with the lusts of deceit, 23 and that you be renewed in the spirit of your mind, 24 and put on the new self, which in the likeness of God has been created in righteousness and holiness of the truth.
Don’t do as the nations do, because they do what they do out of the hardness of their hearts, doing all kinds of impure things. Instead, do those things that are learned from Messiah and drop off the things of your former life. Be renewed in those things that are of Him, living the new life in the likness of G-d, in righteousness and holiness and truth.
And 1 Cor 6:13b - 20 from the NASB: Yet the body is not for immorality, but for R225 the Lord, and the R226 Lord is for the body. 14 Now God has not only raised R227 the Lord, but will R228 also raise us up through His power. 15 Do R229 you not know that your R230 bodies are members of Christ? Shall I then take away the members of Christ and make them members of a prostitute? May R231 it never be! 16 Or do R232 you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, "THE R233 TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH." 17 But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one R234 spirit with Him. 18 Flee R235 immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral F63 man sins against his own body. 19 Or do R236 you not know that your R237 body is a temple F64 of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, F65 and that you R238 are not your own? 20 For you R239 have been bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your R240 body.
Don’t mingle with immorality, because you are now of Messiah. Don’t you understand that when you lie with a prostitute, you become one with the prostitute? But you are now joined with Messiah, and your body is His temple, so don’t mix the holy with the profane. You are not your own; you were purchased with His blood, so glorify Him with your body.
The Mixing the profane or common with the holy will not make the profane or common things holy. It is strongly taught through the Bible that it will not work to mix the two. We, as believers, are to avoid these things in worship.
I hope I have answered your question, then, Mr. Fribbles. It’s getting late.
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