RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central?

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Leon_Figg3 -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/2/2008 9:56:34 PM)
Lizahane, I am a bit confused about your response to my last post. I have stirred clear of all the talk about Obama's religious affiliations, or possible affiliations. I am not all that concerned on what religious basis a political candidate establishes his character on. I would just hope that his standard of conduct and decision making is based on something other than political expediency. Early on in this election process I thought I saw that in Obama. Sadly I have come to the conclusion that I was wrong. (IMO) Obama is a politician with an agenda (remove our troops from Iraq), influenced, managed and supported by people who have an even greater and more destructive agenda.

colliefan -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/2/2008 10:10:44 PM)
The media is giving the guy a pass. If McCain had been given a questionable mortgage loan, the media would be all over him. When Chris Mathews admits to having a barryasm listening to him you know the media is in his camp! No one has questioned him on the over 130 "present" votes to avoid going on record on a topic. When he was a community activist did he really live in the South Side?

lightshineon -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/2/2008 10:16:04 PM)
It is preaching to the choir, they see what they want to see. quote: ORIGINAL: colliefan The media is giving the guy a pass. If McCain had been given a questionable mortgage loan, the media would be all over him. When Chris Mathews admits to having a barryasm listening to him you know the media is in his camp! No one has questioned him on the over 130 "present" votes to avoid going on record on a topic. When he was a community activist did he really live in the South Side?

born2bme -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/3/2008 10:54:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: colliefan The media is giving the guy a pass. If McCain had been given a questionable mortgage loan, the media would be all over him. When Chris Mathews admits to having a barryasm listening to him you know the media is in his camp! No one has questioned him on the over 130 "present" votes to avoid going on record on a topic. When he was a community activist did he really live in the South Side? First of all Obama was not given a questionable mortgage loan. He happened to have good credit given his wife was a lawyer and he had just signed a book deal. quote: LIE: "The freshman Democratic senator received a discount. He locked in an interest rate of 5.625 percent on the 30-year fixed-rate mortgage, below the average for such loans at the time in Chicago. The loan was unusually large, known in banker lingo as a 'super super jumbo.' Obama paid no origination fee or discount points, as some consumers do to reduce their interest rates. Compared with the average terms offered at the time in Chicago, Obama's rate could have saved him more than $300 per month." [Washington Post, 7/2/08] REALITY: OBAMA DID NOT GET SPECIAL TREATMENT AND RECEIVED HIS RATE JUST LIKE ANY OTHER CUSTOMER. HIS RATE IS CONSISTENT WITH RATES FOR OTHERS WITH HIS FINANCIAL PROFILE. REALITY: NORTHERN TRUST DOES NOT HAVE A PROGRAM TO PROVIDE DISCOUNTS TO PUBLIC OFFICIALS Unlike Countrywide Northern Trust Did Not Have A Program To Provide Discounts To Public Officials. "Unlike Countrywide, where leaked internal e-mails documented a special discount program for friends of chief executive Angelo Mozilo, Northern Trust says it has no formal program to provide discounts to public officials." [Washington Post, 7/2/08] And yes, he really did live on the South Side. From his website quote: Remembering the values of empathy and service that his mother taught him, Barack put law school and corporate life on hold after college and moved to Chicago in 1985, where he became a community organizer with a church-based group seeking to improve living conditions in poor neighborhoods plagued with crime and high unemployment. The group had some success, but Barack had come to realize that in order to truly improve the lives of people in that community and other communities, it would take not just a change at the local level, but a change in our laws and in our politics. He went on to earn his law degree from Harvard in 1991, where he became the first African-American president of the Harvard Law Review. Soon after, he returned to Chicago to practice as a civil rights lawyer and teach constitutional law. Finally, his advocacy work led him to run for the Illinois State Senate, where he served for eight years. In 2004, he became the third African American since Reconstruction to be elected to the U.S. Senate. About those 130 present votes (3% of all the votes he cast), Hillary questioned him about them during the primaries. Didn't work that well for her either. You bring shame to yourself or as Mark Twain has said: It is better to be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt." A word for you Proverbs 6:16-19: quote: There are six things the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil, a false witness who pours out lies and a man who stirs up dissension among brothers.

saved9201 -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/3/2008 4:10:06 PM)
Often the girl you date in high school is different from the one you end up marrying. In high school, you want the gorgeous, shapely, exciting girl who makes you laugh, is fun to be with, is "eye candy", and has skills I can't mention on this Christian forum. She may be irresponsible and unintelligent as a brick, but who cares? Obama is that girl. He's the little red corvette. We all know she's no good, too expensive and in the end will break your heart, but we love to talk about her, love to see what she's going to wear to school, love to see what she's going to do say or do next, even though it amounts to nothing of substance. If some of you saw the movie "American Beauty", Obama's the young blonde the Kevin Spacey character spent the entire movie wanting to be with. Then in the end, he found out she wasn't all that. I still believe that when it comes time to actually go into that voting booth, even a lot of black voters like me who felt a sense of pride in seeing him accomplish so much, are going to have to pass on the brother. He's cool and he's got the gift of gab and all, but this is the president of the USA, dude. I'd rather see him lose than see him fail and see the country fall apart and blame him. I think he's over his head. He needs a little more experience, a little more substance in his resume'. So far he's gotten away with not having to show how unprepared for this office he is, because some of you guys are more interested in if he's a Muslim, Hindu or Christian or not, what his pastor, former pastor and visiting pastor said, if he likes white people, who his friends are, who endorsed him, if his wife likes America, why he doesn't wear a flag pin, does he look like Curious George.... I believe he'll lose and lose badly to McCain in November. But for some reason, I still admire the guy for trying, he's just not ready. But he may have saved us from Hillary Clinton, who, in my humble opinion, is downright dangerous. But I won't go there. - Julius

lightshineon -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/3/2008 4:39:33 PM)
The only thing I am proud of is that Obama a black man is given the chance. Not possible a few years back. Us white folks have came along way (LOL), and I praise God for that.

Lizahana -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/3/2008 10:57:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Leon_Figg3 Lizahane, I am a bit confused about your response to my last post. I have stirred clear of all the talk about Obama's religious affiliations, or possible affiliations. I am not all that concerned on what religious basis a political candidate establishes his character on. I would just hope that his standard of conduct and decision making is based on something other than political expediency. Early on in this election process I thought I saw that in Obama. Sadly I have come to the conclusion that I was wrong. (IMO) Obama is a politician with an agenda (remove our troops from Iraq), influenced, managed and supported by people who have an even greater and more destructive agenda. Hi Leon_Figg3, My point was that some that frequent these forums, seem to want to divert attention away from the real issues by focusing on ridiculous notions that Obama is of another religion, other than what he says he is, that his followers chant; that he has tabooh connections; blah, blah, blah - it really is so tiresome and ridiculous that I now yawn when I read it...I used to find it entertaining in the fact that people actually take it seriously...then I saw that some on this forum actually DO take it seriously and was pretty shocked by this...and now that is tempered by the fact that I can't change them...so now, it's pretty dull to me, because no matter, I can't change them, nor do I care to...it is what it is. If people want to get their information from a blog - that's their problem, not mine. Though, that scares me... Anyway, personally, I agree with Obama wanting to remove the troops from Iraq - from your remarks, I gather you probably disagree. I am not going to argue this with you, as I have countless times with some on these forums. And besides, those on the 'War In Iraq' thread do not need me -they do a great job at expressing what I feel - wing2000, rlj and RichLP. Again, I am an independent, and right now I'm leaning towards Obama. Peace and God bless,

Lizahana -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/3/2008 11:01:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: colliefan The media is giving the guy a pass. If McCain had been given a questionable mortgage loan, the media would be all over him. When Chris Mathews admits to having a barryasm listening to him you know the media is in his camp! No one has questioned him on the over 130 "present" votes to avoid going on record on a topic. When he was a community activist did he really live in the South Side? Right - and that's why the 'Obama is a Muslim', 'Obama is a Hindu' , 'Obama has a cult-like following' threads dominate these forums...[:D] That's a good one, though [:D] Peace and God bless,

Lizahana -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/3/2008 11:04:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lightshineon It is preaching to the choir, they see what they want to see. quote: ORIGINAL: colliefan The media is giving the guy a pass. If McCain had been given a questionable mortgage loan, the media would be all over him. When Chris Mathews admits to having a barryasm listening to him you know the media is in his camp! No one has questioned him on the over 130 "present" votes to avoid going on record on a topic. When he was a community activist did he really live in the South Side? I guess us regular folk are just too dumb too see - please excuse us, then. Peace and God bless,

Lizahana -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/3/2008 11:07:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: saved9201 Often the girl you date in high school is different from the one you end up marrying. In high school, you want the gorgeous, shapely, exciting girl who makes you laugh, is fun to be with, is "eye candy", and has skills I can't mention on this Christian forum. She may be irresponsible and unintelligent as a brick, but who cares? Obama is that girl. He's the little red corvette. We all know she's no good, too expensive and in the end will break your heart, but we love to talk about her, love to see what she's going to wear to school, love to see what she's going to do say or do next, even though it amounts to nothing of substance. If some of you saw the movie "American Beauty", Obama's the young blonde the Kevin Spacey character spent the entire movie wanting to be with. Then in the end, he found out she wasn't all that. I still believe that when it comes time to actually go into that voting booth, even a lot of black voters like me who felt a sense of pride in seeing him accomplish so much, are going to have to pass on the brother. He's cool and he's got the gift of gab and all, but this is the president of the USA, dude. I'd rather see him lose than see him fail and see the country fall apart and blame him. I think he's over his head. He needs a little more experience, a little more substance in his resume'. So far he's gotten away with not having to show how unprepared for this office he is, because some of you guys are more interested in if he's a Muslim, Hindu or Christian or not, what his pastor, former pastor and visiting pastor said, if he likes white people, who his friends are, who endorsed him, if his wife likes America, why he doesn't wear a flag pin, does he look like Curious George.... I believe he'll lose and lose badly to McCain in November. But for some reason, I still admire the guy for trying, he's just not ready. But he may have saved us from Hillary Clinton, who, in my humble opinion, is downright dangerous. But I won't go there. - Julius For the first time, Julius, I may just have to disagree with you. I think Obama has a great shot. And the only one to blame is the old machine in Washington - no one particular party in DC, just DC politics. I'm not saying this is a good reason to vote for Obama - to thumb your nose at the 'usual' in DC - I'm just calling it how I see it around where I live. And, I don't think that's such a bad thing at all...course, some on here would say it's a bad wind...but not me. Peace and God bless,

lightshineon -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/4/2008 12:08:37 AM)
You do not have to have a bad attitude, if you do not wish to read others opinions besides yours, and others who agree with you then do not. If someone does not agree with you then, that makes them bad or wrong? Are you wing, and Rich always right? That is very arrogant, and yes, people have right for concern about Obama. Sorry Liz, sometimes the truth bites. The way things are. quote: ORIGINAL: Lizahana quote: ORIGINAL: lightshineon It is preaching to the choir, they see what they want to see. quote: ORIGINAL: colliefan The media is giving the guy a pass. If McCain had been given a questionable mortgage loan, the media would be all over him. When Chris Mathews admits to having a barryasm listening to him you know the media is in his camp! No one has questioned him on the over 130 "present" votes to avoid going on record on a topic. When he was a community activist did he really live in the South Side? I guess us regular folk are just too dumb too see - please excuse us, then. Peace and God bless,

Sophie11 -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/4/2008 9:31:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: saved9201 Often the girl you date in high school is different from the one you end up marrying. In high school, you want the gorgeous, shapely, exciting girl who makes you laugh, is fun to be with, is "eye candy", and has skills I can't mention on this Christian forum. She may be irresponsible and unintelligent as a brick, but who cares? Obama is that girl. He's the little red corvette. We all know she's no good, too expensive and in the end will break your heart, but we love to talk about her, love to see what she's going to wear to school, love to see what she's going to do say or do next, even though it amounts to nothing of substance. If some of you saw the movie "American Beauty", Obama's the young blonde the Kevin Spacey character spent the entire movie wanting to be with. Then in the end, he found out she wasn't all that. I still believe that when it comes time to actually go into that voting booth, even a lot of black voters like me who felt a sense of pride in seeing him accomplish so much, are going to have to pass on the brother. He's cool and he's got the gift of gab and all, but this is the president of the USA, dude. I'd rather see him lose than see him fail and see the country fall apart and blame him. I think he's over his head. He needs a little more experience, a little more substance in his resume'. So far he's gotten away with not having to show how unprepared for this office he is, because some of you guys are more interested in if he's a Muslim, Hindu or Christian or not, what his pastor, former pastor and visiting pastor said, if he likes white people, who his friends are, who endorsed him, if his wife likes America, why he doesn't wear a flag pin, does he look like Curious George.... I believe he'll lose and lose badly to McCain in November. But for some reason, I still admire the guy for trying, he's just not ready. But he may have saved us from Hillary Clinton, who, in my humble opinion, is downright dangerous. But I won't go there. - Julius I agree with your analogy. I don't know about whether or not he will win or lose, but I don't think he is ready to take on the responsibility of POTUS. I also agree that there are so many out there trying to conjure up crazy lies about him that the real BO goes unknown to almost everyone. It's the same in most elections though. It's quite disgusting really. But anyway I will not be voting for him, or McCain. I do not trust a word either of them says.

saved9201 -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/4/2008 9:51:05 AM)
I�ve contended in these forums that the fear of impending doom some people feel concerning an Obama presidency is unnecessary because, first of all, I think this country will do fine with either candidate, and second, I don�t� think Obama wins 10 states. Some may ask about the polls that show him, in some cases, with a double digit lead over McCain. Well, can you really believe those poll numbers? quote: An Atlanta pollster thinks a potentially significant number of people who say they'll vote for Barack Obama won't. David Johnson raised the issue as he discussed his latest Strategic Vision Poll, which shows the Democratic presidential candidate trailing in Georgia. Nationally, Mr. Obama is ahead of Republican candidate John McCain by several percentage points in most surveys. "I think we'll have a Bradley-Wilder effect," Mr. Johnson said Wednesday, referring to two former black Democratic candidates: Tom Bradley, who lost the 1982 race for California governor even though polls just before Election Day said he had a double-digit lead, and Douglas Wilder, who had even bigger leads just before the 1989 governor's election in Virginia but barely won. Many analysts concluded that some whites were hesitant to declare their support for a white candidate over a black one. Others said some voters let a positive view of a black candidate guide their survey responses but yielded to race-related concerns in the voting booth. "I think a lot of people aren't ready yet," Mr. Johnson said. link But I�ve also said that Obama has impressed me a great deal and I admire what he and his campaign staff has done thus far. I know Tiger Woods is known mainly for his long drives and precision putting, but what impresses me most about Tiger is when he makes a bad shot, how he well he recovers. Several times during this campaign, Obama was hit hard with unprecedented attacks, especially with issues dealing with his church, and he recovered. He�s still standing and he was able to frustrate and beat the presumptive shoe-in Democratic nominee, virtually bankrupting her campaign. He also exposed her and her husband, once dubbed the "First Black President", as not who we thought they were, as when the chips were down, Hillary and Bill sought the support of "hard-working white Americans" to come to her rescue, but alas, they were too late. While I�m pessimistic about Obama's chances this time, I still could be wrong. Nonetheless, I think what he�s already done is gotten a lot more young people interested in the political process and has given a lot more kids of color the inspiration to dream a little bigger. The article goes on to say: quote: He compared Mr. Obama to 1928 Democratic candidate Al Smith, the first major-party Catholic presidential nominee. Smith lost but laid the foundation for the 1960 victory of another Catholic, John F. Kennedy, Mr. Johnson said. Maybe he's not the "one" but maybe the next one is. - Julius

Lizahana -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/4/2008 10:56:09 AM)
I don't agree with spreading lies about Obama, McCain, anyone. And on these forums, there are plenty of people that spread lies about Obama, lies like - that he is a Muslim - no wait, now he's a Hindu - no wait, he's part of a cult - it is plain ridiculous and anyone with a mind can see how simply ridiculous it is. Perhaps you are comfortable with this, I most certainly am not. And those that spread these lies about Obama - I thought were hurting him at first - because they don't show his issues. However, I'm beginning to think these silly lies are helping because - people say, well is that true - they google it - then come across his website and look for themselves at the issue. Once they look at the real issues, they forget about the silly, stupid lies that they initially read. Peace and God bless, quote: ORIGINAL: lightshineon You do not have to have a bad attitude, if you do not wish to read others opinions besides yours, and others who agree with you then do not. If someone does not agree with you then, that makes them bad or wrong? Are you wing, and Rich always right? That is very arrogant, and yes, people have right for concern about Obama. Sorry Liz, sometimes the truth bites. The way things are. quote: ORIGINAL: Lizahana quote: ORIGINAL: lightshineon It is preaching to the choir, they see what they want to see. quote: ORIGINAL: colliefan The media is giving the guy a pass. If McCain had been given a questionable mortgage loan, the media would be all over him. When Chris Mathews admits to having a barryasm listening to him you know the media is in his camp! No one has questioned him on the over 130 "present" votes to avoid going on record on a topic. When he was a community activist did he really live in the South Side? I guess us regular folk are just too dumb too see - please excuse us, then. Peace and God bless,

lightshineon -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/4/2008 11:31:59 AM)
Liz, everyone has a right to their opinion right or wrong. This is America, and that is a freedom, that many young men and women have died for. I do not think everyone is wrong about Obama. I know he his polocies are not of God. I read the word, and the word does not line up with his belief system. You know I might like him, seriously, and probaly would vote for him, except, his polocies, his strange bed-fellows, and his lack of experience. Now most of us here are believers in Christ, I believe you are, and I am so lets take the high-road, as this is our faith, and debate without anger. I never called anyone dumb; point of fact, I think you quite intelligent in many areas. I just disagree with you on some issues, but that is ok, we both agree Christ is the only thing that matters. Peace and God Bless, to you.[:D]

SovereignIsHe -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/4/2008 4:17:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Leon_Figg3 What is wrong with people in this forum looking at and examining Obama? Nothing... And if people were silent on Obama they would be called bigots... John

SovereignIsHe -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/4/2008 4:18:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lizahana I don't agree with spreading lies about Obama, McCain, anyone. And on these forums, there are plenty of people that spread lies about Obama, lies like - that he is a Muslim - no wait, now he's a Hindu - no wait, he's part of a cult - it is plain ridiculous and anyone with a mind can see how simply ridiculous it is. Perhaps you are comfortable with this, I most certainly am not. What about those people who spread the lie Obama is a Christian? John

HighPlainsDrifter -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/4/2008 6:55:16 PM)
quote: Nothing... And if people were silent on Obama they would be called bigots... People will be given that title either way if they choose to resist the Obama cult-of-personality.

Lizahana -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/5/2008 12:55:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lightshineon Liz, everyone has a right to their opinion right or wrong. This is America, and that is a freedom, that many young men and women have died for. I do not think everyone is wrong about Obama. I know he his polocies are not of God. I read the word, and the word does not line up with his belief system. You know I might like him, seriously, and probaly would vote for him, except, his polocies, his strange bed-fellows, and his lack of experience. Now most of us here are believers in Christ, I believe you are, and I am so lets take the high-road, as this is our faith, and debate without anger. I never called anyone dumb; point of fact, I think you quite intelligent in many areas. I just disagree with you on some issues, but that is ok, we both agree Christ is the only thing that matters. Peace and God Bless, to you.[:D] lightshineon, Of course everyone has a right to their own opinion. But spreading lies is an entirely different thing and I want no part of it. And agreed. Peace and God bless,

Lizahana -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/5/2008 1:07:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe quote: ORIGINAL: Lizahana I don't agree with spreading lies about Obama, McCain, anyone. And on these forums, there are plenty of people that spread lies about Obama, lies like - that he is a Muslim - no wait, now he's a Hindu - no wait, he's part of a cult - it is plain ridiculous and anyone with a mind can see how simply ridiculous it is. Perhaps you are comfortable with this, I most certainly am not. What about those people who spread the lie Obama is a Christian? John Well, John, Obama says he's a Christian, just like you say you are a Christian. Obama was baptized. I have no power to judge that he is not a Christian. Now, I know you are going to say that you have the power to judge him a Christian or not. [:D] Go right ahead, all powerful one [:D] Peace and God bless,

tafkam -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/5/2008 2:15:38 PM)
Actually, we do...Scripture says that we will know them (Christians) by their fruits....can you show me a single "fruit" that Obama puts forth that falls in line with Scripture? Gay rights? Strike one... Abortion on demand? Strike two.... Spending twenty years in a church that preaches hatred and racism? Strike three....

SovereignIsHe -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/5/2008 2:25:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lizahana Well, John, Obama says he's a Christian, just like you say you are a Christian. Obama was baptized. I have no power to judge that he is not a Christian. So.... By supporting aboriton and the gay agenda he says in a much louder fashion it's a lie... It would seem if a person told you they were not punching you in the face you'd believe them, at least up to the point you were knocked out by thier blows... quote: Now, I know you are going to say that you have the power to judge him a Christian or not. [:D] Go right ahead, all powerful one [:D] Power? Nope... Just the command of God... Unlike yourself I understand that in order to not be led by wolves in sheepskins I must judge folks� Many commands of God require the exercise of righteous judgment.... "But we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw from every brother who walks disorderly and not according to the tradition which he received from us" (2 Thessalonians 3:6). "And if anyone does not obey our word in this epistle, note that person and do not keep company with him, that he may be ashamed. Yet do not count him as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother" (2 Thessalonians 3:14,15). "Teach and exhort these things. If anyone teaches otherwise and does not consent to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness, he is proud, knowing nothing, but is obsessed with disputes and arguments over words, from which come envy, strife, reviling, evil suspicions, useless wrangling of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. From such withdraw yourself" (2 Timothy 6:2b-5). "Now I urge you, brethren, note those who cause divisions and offenses, contrary to the doctrine which you learned, and avoid them. For those who are such do not serve our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly, and by smooth words and flattering speech deceive the hearts of the simple" (Romans 16:17,18). All these commands require the careful exercise of righteousness judgment. Do not be deceived by smooth words and flattering speech. Beware of wolves who come to you with a sheep's skin. We must be careful not to make unqualified judgments. But we must judge appropriately when commanded to do so. "Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment" (John 7:24). Leviticus 19:15. "You shall do no injustice in judgment. You shall not be partial to the poor, nor honor the person of the mighty. But in righteousness you shall judge your neighbor." "And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them" (Ephesians 5:11). Expose them... John

SovereignIsHe -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/5/2008 2:28:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tafkam Actually, we do...Scripture says that we will know them (Christians) by their fruits....can you show me a single "fruit" that Obama puts forth that falls in line with Scripture? Gay rights? Strike one... Abortion on demand? Strike two.... Spending twenty years in a church that preaches hatred and racism? Strike three.... Titus 3:10-11 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject; Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself. John

saved9201 -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/5/2008 3:31:10 PM)
Okay John and Tafkam, So, let's for arguments sake say that because Obama supports gay rights, abortion and because he sat in the "wrong" church for 20 years, three strikes and you're out -that he's not a Christian. Don't know where that's written. I always thought if you accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, you're a Christian. Period. But like I said, lets for arguments sake say those three sins are show stoppers and he's not a child of God. Okay. So do we have any biblical proof that McCain is a Christian? How bout any of the other candidates running for president? Since "there is none righteous, no not one," why should we even vote, if we are going to be held accountable by God for voting for the "wrong" guy (I say guy because voting for a woman could also be conscrued as unbiblical)? While we're on the subject, those who have decided Obama wasn't a Christian, name the presidents who you can prove were Christians, using the same criteria you judged Obama on - three strikes and you're out. That means anyone who's wrong on any three issues is automatically disqualified from being a Christian. Unless you can conclude and biblically prove that those three "strikes" - abortion, gay rights and sitting in the wrong church for 20 years, are the only show stoppers that exist? - Julius

tafkam -> RE: Is it just me, or is this Obama Watch Central? (7/5/2008 4:22:49 PM)
Well, for starters, this thread is about Obama, not McCain. If you want to start a thread on McCain's Christianity, by all means do so and I'll see you there. And none of the sins listed are "show stoppers" as we can be forgiven of our sins. But a Christian does not willfully continue in unrepentant sin. Or at least we should strive not to. Obama not only endorses the issues mentioned, he has veritably wrapped himself in them. How many pastors would keep their jobs if they came out in support of abortion rights or gay marriage? So why does Obama get a pass because he's a politician? God's grace does not give us free reign to go and do as we please....

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