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Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/5/2008 2:12:04 AM
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Christian30
Posts: 205
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: Stafford, TX (Houston suburb)
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As a business traveler who eats in restaurants on a regular basis, until the last 18 months I had limited exposure to the perspectives of restaurant servers. I tip well (15 to 20 percent) if service is mediocre or better, and still tip if it is lousy. I never had a feel for what other people do about tipping until this involvement from family members.
Starting in late 2006, one of my children started working as a server, then a couple of months ago another one did. They tell incredible stories about tipping. In my daughter's restaurant, well more than half tip well. It was more mixed in her former restaurant. Where my son works it is hit and miss.
As I hear all of their stories, there is a pattern among those who tip on the low side or not at all. That is, these are most often the high maintenance customers. By this I mean that they are picky about preparation, constantly want little things and make no effort to ask for more than 1 thing at once, get openly angry at servers (not just complain) when the food is not prepared to expectations, and sometimes these groups of people are rude.
Please be aware that servers do NOT get minimum wage to augment tipping. It is usually closer to $2 per hour. The job is often high stress, with a learning curve and training that is usually unpaid. I'm disappointed that so many people do not respect restaurant culture as it has been established in the U.S.
My children struggle with their attitude towards different types of people because of this issue. There are definite patterns among diffeent cultures, socioeconomic backgrounds, etc. Our son is saddened that it makes him more prone to racism, which we have always tried to teach against and not instill in our children.
Has anyone ever had any experience in improving this situation? Is there any way to better inform society of their responsbility in this area? I'm jjust not sure.
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/5/2008 10:28:57 AM
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Szaftoo
Posts: 861
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: So. Calif.
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Though I always tip, I can see why some people wouldn't. The food and how it's prepared is not the fault of the server, however, how they handle it is. There will always be difficult and demanding customers but it's just part of the job. I know servers who consistently make good money and others who barely get by and it's all about attitude.
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/5/2008 2:29:55 PM
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humbleinspirit
Posts: 17005
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: Just Outside of Boston
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Well, from a customers point of view, the door swings both ways. I have had experiences where servers were slow to wait on you, not check up on how things are going, dissapear when you are desperately waiting for the check, etc. With that said, I do tip fairly well, however it nerves me when servers are like this.
Another thing that bothers me is when servers expect a large tip, well beyond 15-20% as if it is expected also.
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/7/2008 4:03:13 AM
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Rumely
Posts: 125
Joined: 11/11/2007
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Personally, I just wish all establishments would just pay the workers a decent wage and charge whatever for meals, rooms, services necessary to cover it. I don't like having to calculate the math or have change handy or try to determine whether the service I am receiving at a given time is one where tipping is customary. At one establishment, I always tipped my hairstylist. Come to find out, she just charged me that much less for my haircuts.
Maybe I'm just confused, but wasn't 10% the standard decades ago? Then it was 15%, and now it looks like it's headed for 20%. I pretty much live under a rock, only crawling out now and then when I must, so I have a difficult time keeping up with social conventions.
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/7/2008 5:51:03 PM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 1299
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
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I was a waiter/server "back in the day" (1992-1994ish)....
I experienced both ends of the spectrum....bad tippers, great tippers and everything in between...the great tippers always "made up" for the cheapskates...
if someone doesn't want to tip well, then, go to a fast food joint where tipping isn't something that is "expected"
I tip 15%-18% for "average"......I'll go as low as 10% if a server shows no "interest" in providing good service at all....(i have probably done 0 on ocassion, as well).....
though, if the server is excellent, it's close to 20%.....ESPECIALLY, if we're in an area like where my in-laws live (rural arkansas, big retirement area)....if the service is exceptional at a place up there, I make a point of tipping especially good, since that exceptional server probably doesn't typically get tipped as well as he/she should....so, i make sure to put in some "extra"....
we have 5-6 restaurants in our "general area" here in Dallas, where we request specific servers BY NAME....(once you get a REALLY good server somewhere, you REMEMBER them....and, believe me, when you specifically ask for them, they certainly remember you, too...and take "extra" good care of you)
being a waiter/server is a job EVERYONE should have at one time or another....it really makes you appreciate a good one when you're the customer at a restaurant....and, you realize how much hard work it really is (much more than just taking orders and delivering food).....
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Erin, Emilie and Elise
Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/7/2008 6:03:14 PM
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GregandJenny
Posts: 556
Joined: 2/16/2006
From: Near Seattle Washington
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quote:
Please be aware that servers do NOT get minimum wage to augment tipping. It is usually closer to $2 per hour.
That depends on your state and local laws. Anyways I tip decent. It really depends on the service. I look at it like this. If there is not good service then there is no tip.
G
_____________________________
The Will of God never takes you to where the Grace of God will not protect you
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/7/2008 6:06:34 PM
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earthless
Posts: 5771
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are getting their sweaters ready....
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Christian30
There are definite patterns among different cultures, socioeconomic backgrounds, etc. Our son is saddened that it makes him more prone to racism, which we have always tried to teach against and not instill in our children.
Sad, but often true. There does seem to be some cultural groups that demand excellent service, are picky and problematic, and yet do not tip well and or have horrific attitudes.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Christian30
Has anyone ever had any experience in improving this situation?
Some people are just ignorant, some more than others and when their attitude is, "it's everyone else's fault but my own..." promoted by those in their communities that preach to them that everyone else is wrong and they are entitled to ____ and _____, I don't see how that can change easily.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Christian30
Is there any way to better inform society of their responsibility in this area? I'm just not sure.
When I was a pastor of a large inner-city church, I always made it a point on Sunday's to remind the church that one of the saddest things about Sundays was how self-professing Christians would be the ones jamming up the restaurants, ripe with rudeness, horrible manners, demanding and ignorant. And that the servers, restaurant knew these were the Christians, the church crowds...
Worst of all? Servers will always tell me that those are the worst tippers.
Shame on us.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/7/2008 6:08:55 PM
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NoShow
Posts: 436
Joined: 5/10/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Christian30
My children struggle with their attitude towards different types of people because of this issue. There are definite patterns among diffeent cultures, socioeconomic backgrounds, etc. Our son is saddened that it makes him more prone to racism, which we have always tried to teach against and not instill in our children.
He should use this as a learning tool to see that racism (and\or prejudice) is wrong. That it's never ALL of "those people".
quote:
Is there any way to better inform society of their responsbility in this area?
It's tipping. There is no "responsibility" on the part of the customer. As an (ex-)server, I always approached it from appreciating what I received, rather than focusing on what I didn't.
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/7/2008 7:45:41 PM
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AngieCat
Posts: 165
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I can't come up with a way to inform the public.
As a former waitress, my experience is that the size of tips received depends on how the customer usually tips as well as what restaurant the waitress works in. One can't stop a customer from tipping 10% all of the time but can decide to apply for a restaurant job in a "nicer" establishment. I worked at a Denny's and got horrible tips and have worked at Olive Garden and gotten much better tips. So maybe your kids can find a different restaurant to serve at.
_____________________________
Angela
Blessed Mother of one with Hannah Nicole on the way - due Nov. 30th
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/7/2008 11:24:50 PM
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buckifn
Posts: 1710
Joined: 5/23/2006
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Today we had a really bad waiter. We ordered pancakes for breakfast and did not receive any syrup to go with them. I had to spend several minutes trying to get the waiter's attention, he was laughing and joking with a party 3 tables over....and then when I finally got him over to our table he was gone several minutes before he brought the syrup back.
By that time none of us wanted the pancakes. they were cold and the whipped topping had began to be watery.
If I had a pen and paper available I would have left them a note about why their tip was less than what I usually like to give, but instead I made a mental note of their name and will make sure I never have that waiter again.
So I would say if the waiter and waitress pay attention to details and give efficient service then yes by all means they earn a good tip, but weak service = a weak tip imo
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/8/2008 10:57:37 AM
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BlueAdept
Posts: 99
Joined: 4/18/2005
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One of the struggles I have with tipping is I do recall when tipping was "suggested" at 10%. So you go out have a meal the bill came back at 20.00 and you left a 2.00 tip. Then tipping went from 10% to 15%, all the while the bill went from 20.00 to 25.00.
Now I see someone saying it looks like tipping is going up to 20% of the bill. Hey I don't mind tipping a good server, when they do a good job they have EARNED that tip. But I do get upset both with people that skip the tip, and equally so with servers that do a half job.
I don't think I am demanding. When I sit down I expect that my server will be at my table within 2-3 minutes. I expect they will be asking what I want to drink and get water on the table as well within a short time. If I have been waiting for 20-30 minutes to be seated, I expect that the place is busy, but I also know some resturants expect servers to cover far too many tables. If the server has 6 tables that could be fine, or it could be 3 too many. Have all the tables been seated at the same time? Most times the people seating the diners will not do that, but once in a while they will.
I can not think of anytime in the past 10 years that I have skipped a tip. Heck I can't think of anytime in the past 20 years. I have left some small tips, but that was because of horrible service.
If you REALLY want to get your message across that the service what bad, then don't skip the tip. Leave something like a dime or 2 pennies. That will give a much clearer message than skipping it.
I have heard many pastors and people say that Chirstians are the worst customers. We come in after church all decked out, demand the best service are picky about everything; then either walk out without tipping or leave some pathetic tip. Man what a witness that leaves. Hey lets invite the server to our church. Chances are she/he didn't want to work that shift but was scheduled and had to work it. It is pretty bad that the unsaved are better tippers than we are, and we will think we are doing great by leaving a track; "since salvation is so great." Only problem is salvation doesn't feed the body, and that is why servers are working.
Oh and I know I am preaching to the choir here, since I know none of US are the ones skipping tips and being demanding.
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/8/2008 11:47:15 AM
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IMA_CHRISTIAN
Posts: 999
Joined: 1/23/2006
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when i got out to eat myself, i might pay like $15 or $18 for the meal which even at 20% leaves only a couple dollars. On a holiday, i feel bad that the waitress worked really hard or even average, on me, to only get like $2.00.
so i give them an extra dollar or two if they have done an ok job or a good job. just coz they served me and waited on me on a holiday. who wants to work on a holiday for just a measly $2.00 tip? so i feel for them.
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/8/2008 2:31:51 PM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 1299
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
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quote:
I have heard many pastors and people say that Chirstians are the worst customers. We come in after church all decked out, demand the best service are picky about everything; then either walk out without tipping or leave some pathetic tip. Man what a witness that leaves. Hey lets invite the server to our church. Chances are she/he didn't want to work that shift but was scheduled and had to work it. It is pretty bad that the unsaved are better tippers than we are, and we will think we are doing great by leaving a track; "since salvation is so great." Only problem is salvation doesn't feed the body, and that is why servers are working.
As I mentioned earlier...i was a server at a restaurant at one time (it was an O'Charley's restaurant, by the way....for you folks who live primarily in the Southeast, you'll know what place Iam talking about)
and, sunday brunch time WAS the "worst" time to work unfortunately.....and, unfortunately, it was primarily those who you could tell that just came out of church that didn't tip well. (I knew it....all the servers knew it....from opening the restaurant at 10:30 am on Sunday until mid-afternoon that day, it was BUSY, and your tips were WAY OFF compared to similarily busy times on other days of the week)
Yes...i COULD have probably asked for Sundays OFF, and been to church, but I knew going in that they were open 7 days a week.....so, i took the ocassional sunday shifts that I did, in order to "do my part" towards running the place....
I find it odd, as well, that it's Christians who are the first to proclaim that all businesses should be closed on Sundays "for the employees" (look at chick-fil-a, hobby lobby and others.....being "closed on sunday" is great marketing for them)....
BUT, it's those VERY SAME people that go out to eat as soon as church is dismissed.....
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Erin, Emilie and Elise
Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/8/2008 3:18:29 PM
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woodsandfield
Posts: 59
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Christian30
As I hear all of their stories, there is a pattern among those who tip on the low side or not at all. That is, these are most often the high maintenance customers. By this I mean that they are picky about preparation, constantly want little things and make no effort to ask for more than 1 thing at once, get openly angry at servers (not just complain) when the food is not prepared to expectations, and sometimes these groups of people are rude.
Please be aware that servers do NOT get minimum wage to augment tipping. It is usually closer to $2 per hour. The job is often high stress, with a learning curve and training that is usually unpaid. I'm disappointed that so many people do not respect restaurant culture as it has been established in the U.S.
My children struggle with their attitude towards different types of people because of this issue. There are definite patterns among diffeent cultures, socioeconomic backgrounds, etc. Our son is saddened that it makes him more prone to racism, which we have always tried to teach against and not instill in our children.
Has anyone ever had any experience in improving this situation? Is there any way to better inform society of their responsbility in this area? I'm jjust not sure.
Improving the situation? How about something I grew up with; it's called customer service.
Yes, while I went to school, I did some time waitressing and I knew that if I wanted a good tip, I should:
A) approach the table in a timely manner
Translation: people don't want to sit there 10 minutes before they "catch the eye of a server"
B) Rudeness matters; if a server is unfriendly, abrupt or short with the
customers, it's going to reflect in the tip
C) Get the order right; yeah, that does matter, and bring everything: napkins, ketchup, knives, forks, spoon, sugar, creamer, etc.
I suspect that this is called " high maintenance".
D) Don't always be " cleaning up".
People go out to eat because they want a break and a chance to socialize.
A wait staff that is always cleaning up is a royal pain: it reflects in the tip.
E) The racism is BS. A good waiter/waitress will be appreciated no matter the color or race. Nothing is ever 100% or always, but the majority of the time, it's not about race but service.
F) a tip is not an entitlement, especially now, when people are cutting back on extras, good service is a basic.
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/9/2008 10:20:36 PM
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humbleinspirit
Posts: 17005
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: Just Outside of Boston
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kernsfamily
we have 5-6 restaurants in our "general area" here in Dallas, where we request specific servers BY NAME....(once you get a REALLY good server somewhere, you REMEMBER them....and, believe me, when you specifically ask for them, they certainly remember you, too...and take "extra" good care of you)
Yes, I like good waitresses too, and kinda cringe anytime I go to my regular restaurant and get somebody new instead. Not only do they not know what I want, but they tend to be quite un-attentive also. (waiting too long for another drink, slow service, etc.) BTW, I do tip well also.
quote:
being a waiter/server is a job EVERYONE should have at one time or another....it really makes you appreciate a good one when you're the customer at a restaurant....and, you realize how much hard work it really is (much more than just taking orders and delivering food).....
Nah, knowing all that I know about the profession now, I think that I'd rather forgo that torture instead. 
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/10/2008 8:53:28 AM
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zoebob
Posts: 8895
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
Status: online
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quote:
he was laughing and joking with a party 3 tables over
That's not necessarily the waiter's fault. If the party at the table is keeping them there then to break away and say "I have other tables" could come across as rude to that party.
quote:
C) Get the order right; yeah, that does matter, and bring everything: napkins, ketchup, knives, forks, spoon, sugar, creamer, etc.
I suspect that this is called " high maintenance".
No that's not high maintanance. However, a table that wants some wierd condiment that you wouldn't expect with the order and doesn't mention it when you ask if there's anything else they need only to angriliy call you over when you are trying to take the next table's order. Who want 10 extra things and ask for them one at a time instead of all together when they know they want them all. Who tell you everything is fine when you ask and then complain to the manager. Those kids of things are high maintanance.
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L-R: DD1, Ellies DS2, DD2, Ellies DS1
L-R: Ellies DD1, Ellies DD2, DS, Ellies DS3
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/10/2008 9:54:21 AM
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woodsandfield
Posts: 59
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
quote:
C) Get the order right; yeah, that does matter, and bring everything: napkins, ketchup, knives, forks, spoon, sugar, creamer, etc.
I suspect that this is called " high maintenance".
No that's not high maintanance. However, a table that wants some wierd condiment that you wouldn't expect with the order and doesn't mention it when you ask if there's anything else they need only to angriliy call you over when you are trying to take the next table's order. Who want 10 extra things and ask for them one at a time instead of all together when they know they want them all. Who tell you everything is fine when you ask and then complain to the manager. Those kids of things are high maintanance.
Wierd condiment? steak sauce? hot sauce? I can't imagine what you mean by a weird condiment! You'll have to spell out what your definition of " weird condiment " means!
You mention: 10 condiments one at a time for a table of shrills when you've been attentive, polite and provide timely service....sounds like a very rare thing.
I can't even imagine that, sorry.
It probably does happen but I've always been in a party that is polite and friendly and good tippers.
The odd condiment, that cracks me up. I can't wait to hear what the average odd condiment is.
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/10/2008 10:09:32 AM
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zoebob
Posts: 8895
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
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For example, ranch dressing with french fries. Steak sauce with pizza. Who knows.
I don't necessarily mean 10 condiments but maybe you go and ask if anyone wants their drink refilled. One person says yes. You see 2-3 other empty or nearly empty glasses on the table. You bring back drink 1 and person 2 says "Oh, I'd like a refill" You ask if anyone else would like one. Everyone else says they are fine. You bring back refill #2 and all the sudden #3 wants one. You sould spend 10 mins getting drinks for 1 table.
_____________________________
L-R: DD1, Ellies DS2, DD2, Ellies DS1
L-R: Ellies DD1, Ellies DD2, DS, Ellies DS3
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/10/2008 10:46:05 AM
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zoebob
Posts: 8895
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
Status: online
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Those condiments might be "ordinary" but not what you would automatically bring when delivering a plate of french fries. If I bring your meal, ask if there is anything else you need, you tell me no, and then I go to wait on my next table. Then while I'm in the middle of taking that order you start waving frantically and asking why I didn't bring you the ranch dressing (that you never aksed for) and then decide not to tip me because I didn't read your mind to know you wanted it what more could I do.
_____________________________
L-R: DD1, Ellies DS2, DD2, Ellies DS1
L-R: Ellies DD1, Ellies DD2, DS, Ellies DS3
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/10/2008 11:07:54 AM
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GregandJenny
Posts: 556
Joined: 2/16/2006
From: Near Seattle Washington
Status: online
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quote:
I can't imagine what you mean by a weird condiment!
My sister likes ranch on her pancakes, so if she orders pancakes he is gonna want ranch sauce and she never orders hashbrowns.
G
_____________________________
The Will of God never takes you to where the Grace of God will not protect you
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/10/2008 11:31:50 AM
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woodsandfield
Posts: 59
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: zoebob
Those condiments might be "ordinary" but not what you would automatically bring when delivering a plate of french fries. If I bring your meal, ask if there is anything else you need, you tell me no, and then I go to wait on my next table. Then while I'm in the middle of taking that order you start waving frantically and asking why I didn't bring you the ranch dressing (that you never aksed for) and then decide not to tip me because I didn't read your mind to know you wanted it what more could I do.
It sounds like you need comfortable shoes or a more upscale restaurant.
PS I don't like ranch dressing
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/10/2008 11:33:53 AM
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woodsandfield
Posts: 59
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: GregandJenny
quote:
I can't imagine what you mean by a weird condiment!
My sister likes ranch on her pancakes, so if she orders pancakes he is gonna want ranch sauce and she never orders hashbrowns.
G
Wow, ranch dressing on pancakes, that is different!
Does she get any flak from the waitress?
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/10/2008 11:54:58 AM
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GregandJenny
Posts: 556
Joined: 2/16/2006
From: Near Seattle Washington
Status: online
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no, but she expects it to be brought out without asking.
G
_____________________________
The Will of God never takes you to where the Grace of God will not protect you
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RE: Woes on Tipping in Restaurants - 7/10/2008 12:06:15 PM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 1299
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
Status: offline
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regarding being "high maintainance".....when it's me, my wife and our 3 kids, it's EASY to feel like we're being VERY "high maintainance".....sometimes it seems as if we're ALWAYS asking for SOMETHING.....and, having them running their legs off!
a good server will at least "present" the "attitude" of "no problem"...."my pleasure to get that for you" (even though it's the 10th thing you asked for in 10 minutes).....and, when I realize that we were "high maintainance", and they had a good attitude about it, I will tip on the "high side"....
though, there are servers who, after a request or two, will have the attitude of "WHAT in the world do you want NOW? can't you just leave me ALONE????".....they don't get tipped quite as well....
again...it's all in the "presentation" of attitude....i don't care about what they might be THINKING....(even I had a bad attitude "on the inside" about some customers when i was a server....)....it's all in the "PRESENTATION'.....it's a PERFORMANCE....and, in this performance, you have to at least ACT like you care about what you're doing....and, if you don't have to "Act" like you care, and you truly DO care about doing a great job, then, that's when being a server is really FUN....i had a pretty good time with it, really....
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Erin, Emilie and Elise
Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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