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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/17/2008 3:12:14 PM
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fiat_lux
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quote:
Yeah that's a reasonable take. Would you say that it's somewhat like the first option I listed (times were different then), perhaps with an expansion on what that means?
Yeah, I suppose you could say that.
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/18/2008 3:04:09 PM
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fiat_lux
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quote:
I think we can compare the verses of treating slaves to our modern day employees and employers. Same master slave concept. That is why I like the union so much. I don't like bullies and they need to be kept accountable and people ought to be protected from that which they have no power over.
Interesting analogy and I think you may be right, in the sense that the protections included for Israelites are based on the assumption that if there are going to be relationships where some people have power over others, then the people with power also have moral responsibilities regarding the well-being of those under them. Obviously the concept of a labour union would be completely foreign to the Israelites of the Old Testament, but still, I like the analogy.
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/18/2008 6:25:34 PM
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Giulia
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Yes, I see the union as the same function the Lord's intervention has. It is a separate entity which keeps everyone fair and creates a bridge between two parties with different interests. It is the entity which keeps all accountable to a higher purpose, namely the standard of God.
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Captured by His love. Justified by His grace.
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/18/2008 10:48:39 PM
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PaleHawkWoman
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I prefer to refer to Jesus'admonition "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you"
How many of you would want to be a slave?
How many of you would want your wife/children to be slaves for life?
How many of you would want to be beaten or be injured with no legal right to protect yourself?
How many of you would want the fruits of your labors belonging to and profitting someone else?
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/19/2008 4:37:46 AM
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Giulia
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quote:
I prefer to refer to Jesus'admonition "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you"
Yes but not all people agree with this and many Christians don't even practice it. That is why you need to have a higher standard holding accountable the two parties. What do you do? Get em in a head lock? (believe me there has been many a time where if not for self control I would have done this very easily), best to tread with the boots of peace and the higher standard will speak on behalf of God, sometimes even OT law for those unbelievers or those believers that don't love their neighbour as themself.
I would really like a pair of green cowboy boots, looked everywhere in the shops where they import, no size 39s anywhere in green. They really look like peacable shoes that don't get walked on either. Anyone got any clues as to where I could find some please send me a pm. I'm not sure if I am allowed to do this but I am happy to pay up to 200 bucks for a good pair. Please let me know if I'm out of order with that last bit moderator.
< Message edited by Giulia -- 7/19/2008 7:48:30 AM >
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/19/2008 8:41:49 AM
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abraxas
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But the OT permits a slaveholder to beat his slave, as long as the slave doesn't die that day. He can die the next day and that's okay! The OT permits him to retain the freed debt-slave's wife/children for life. What does the freed slave have to do if he doesn't want to be a slave for life as well? Does he divorce his wife? If slavery is so wrong, and killing another person so wrong, why did God permit them, at all, ever?
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/19/2008 7:53:42 PM
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Giulia
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I don't think God permitted it, I think He just allowed it. Man certainly became quite barbaric in the depravity of sin. God allows us to be barbaric if we so wish. He just waits and hopes we choose life instead of death.
_____________________________
Captured by His love. Justified by His grace.
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/20/2008 12:44:01 PM
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HHV5
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I've also been told that slavery during the Biblical times was nothing like the enslavement of African people.
Also, I don't think anyone's mentioned the racist ideology (ie: people with dark skin tone are cursed and sub-human) that people used to justify slave ownership.
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/21/2008 7:52:18 AM
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Giulia
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From: Giulia
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Same as females, often treated as sub human. I often feel black. The black guys I know tell me I am black on the inside. When they try to act racists I remind them I am olive just to make things difficult!
_____________________________
Captured by His love. Justified by His grace.
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/21/2008 11:15:32 PM
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fallenstar
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Slavery is WRONG. I don't care what the Bible says about it, slavery is messed up.
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RE: Is slavery wrong? - 7/21/2008 11:28:07 PM
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GroupW
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There's an excellent book on this topic by the way by Wm. Webb called "Slaves, Women, and Homosexuals"
I think the treatment of biblical slavery from a hermeneutical point of view is a good one. For those who are interested, I can try to put together a synopsis of the argument tomorrow or Wednesday. Basically, his argument is that within the bible itself, though it does not explicitly condemn slavery, there is a "moral trajectory" that's evident. While the biblical commandments to slaves and masters provide improved protections to the slaves and were counter to the prevailing culture of the day, it is possible to imagine continuing that trajectory forward into a new and more ethical treatment of individuals - a complete abolition of the practice.
For those seriously concerned with this historical issue, I'd fully recommend the book.
_____________________________
“For every problem, there is a solution that is simple, elegant and wrong.” -H.L. Mencken
"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so." -Bertrand Russell
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