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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/6/2008 2:16:44 AM
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kisstheson
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Focusing
I am replying strictly to the OP, and haven't read through the other 90+ responses in this thread ...
While I do not believe it's appropriate to idolize something (which can be considered hanging a cross and praying to it, imo), if a church does not have a cross I don't want to attend it.
Why?
Simply because I feel it's a representation and reminder of what He went through for us. If I can't be reminded that He gave His life for me when I go to a church and am praising Him along with many other believers, there is something missing.
My favorite way to be in touch with Him is in nature ... nature screams God to me, pure and simple ... but if I am going somewhere, a building, a community event in the form of a church service, I feel it's important to have that as a visual reminder, something that triggers my mind and puts me in a place of complete humility. As a visually-oriented person, this is something that's important to me. I'm not sure it's the same for everyone else.
no wonder why your name is "focusing.' You gave me hope for this thread.
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This is my Beloved. This is my friend. (Song of Solomon)
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/6/2008 4:48:33 AM
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musicboss11
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I'm still not clear on what displaying a cross has to do with what is taught/preached from the pulpit
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/6/2008 11:46:52 AM
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Covaan_Meshuga
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Not unintelligent at ALL! Very well-put!
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Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/6/2008 11:58:13 AM
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Covaan_Meshuga
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Zzzactly.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/6/2008 11:59:44 AM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3640
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kisstheson
quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
quote:
But, at least, I got to use my newly-acquired word three times!
Have you become a Southern Bell? 
If not, you have the southern charm down pat!
Hee-hee-hee! I haven't used it in real-life speech yet, but it certainly would shock my children and others who know me, way up here in the far-northern Northwest!
But there's something purifying about using it, y'all! I think I've gotten in touch with my roots!
But back to the cross --
I am curious: do those of you who use crosses use simple crosses or crucifixes?
Not long ago, someone on CW mentioned a young woman s/he heard buying jewelry, and the young woman asked for something like "one of those crosses with the little man pinned on it." Many who use crosses have no clue what they mean. Having a cross does not make one holier.
Who said wearing a cross makes one holier than thou? certainly not me. I don't wear a cross. what I am talking about is modern churches no longer displaying the cross in their buildings. Instead they have a globe or flags. This is only a recent thing. For centuries Christians were proud of the cross as it inspired love and devotion towards Jesus.
Now as for the woman's comment about the crucifix if someone asked me about the man pinned on it this would have been and excellent time to share what Jesus has done for us.
I may not wear a cross but I do have the name of jesus tattoed on my hand with a rose and thorns.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/6/2008 12:01:32 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3640
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kisstheson
Who said wearing a cross makes one holier than thou? certainly not me. I don't wear a cross. what I am talking about is modern churches no longer displaying the cross in their buildings.
I'm sorry, Kiss, but you really must take more care in reading what people actually write rather than reading posts with preconceived ideas about what will be written or with an agenda. I know -- we all do this at times, but it has been done several times in your thread.
If you will note, my question was:
quote:
ORIGINAL Abiyah
I am curious: do those of you who use crosses use simple crosses or crucifixes?
That does not ask about "wearing" crosses. I was asking about using them, and it really was a simple, straight-forward question.
quote:
ORIGINAL: kisstheson
Instead they have a globe or flags. This is only a recent thing. For centuries Christians were proud of the cross as it inspired love and devotion towards jests. My suggestion for you, then, is to not attend such churches. We all have concepts that make churches unacceptable for us, so we don't go to them. It really is simple.
Perhaps those churches that don't display the crosses have done some studying that has changed their minds about using them. The fact is that anyone can die on a cross: Messiah was one among thousands who did. But there is only one who ever arose from the grave, after three days in it, by His own volition, to walk the earth, then ascend to the Father by His own will, and remain there with wounds in His hands and feet. Therefore, perhaps they should take the idea someone mentioned earlier in your thread: display the empty tomb rather than a cross.
quote:
ORIGINAL: kisstheson
I may not wear a cross but I do have the name of jests tattoed on my hand with a rose and thorns.
Now, that is an interesting concept. I suppose this might invite the subject of whether or not tattoos are legitimate for a believer. Since you are the thread's OP, and you brought it up, I will simply answer that if I had a tattoo, which I don't, I would do everything I could to hide it. In fact, after reading the Bible, I would not have one. But that's just my opinion, I am sure.
No, I don't wear a cross, but I do wear a small mezuzzah and some kind of pro-life jewelry at all times.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/6/2008 12:15:09 PM
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ta_mosquito
Posts: 11499
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From: from MN, now in Ontario :D
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quote:
You can have the bumper sticker, wear the t-shirt, wear the cross, you can have every form of Christian propaganda that is out there, but unless you KNOW Jesus all that you have will be meaningless and fade...
This reminds me of a Steven Curtis Chapman song, "The Change" -
Well I got myself a t-shirt that says what I believe
I got letters on my bracelet to serve as my ID
I got the necklace and the key chain
And almost everything a good Christian needs, yeah
I got the little Bible magnets on my refrigerator door
And a welcome mat to bless you before you walk across my floor
I got a Jesus bumper sticker
And the outline of a fish stuck on my car
And even though this stuff's all well and good, yeah
I cannot help but ask myself...
THE REST HERE
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Tricia
"There's a fine line between being open-minded and empty-headed." ~Michael Coren
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/6/2008 8:05:50 PM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 3396
Joined: 4/16/2005
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No one can look at me or my home or my car and see Jesus advertised.
I am not sure you can be with me and know Jesus is my Lord on a casual basis.
If you deal with me...now....you will see Jesus if you are a little more than superficial. My integrity. My generosity. My love as a verb....not as acting.
I hate fake people. Come up to me all frieindly like you've known me for years? I'll be polite...and move on.
Cover yourself with tattoos and wwjd braclettes and bumper stickers and t shirts and talk the christianese.....it....means.....nothing. In fact it often can describe you as a very superficial person.
Wanna see Jesus? See what I do for the people at work who hate me....and you would have to really look because what I do, I do in secrecy....
and THAT...is what disturbs me greatly about this displaying the cross stuff. Its blatant advertising of the supposed Jesus in you and I believe that is against the biblical principles presented in Matthew 6 where the pharesees would fast and make iot known they were "suffering" for the Lord to garner attention.
Jesus is not in an idol or adornment or advertisement. Jesus is in your heart and how you love people...and how humble you are doing that. When you can sacrificially love...and NO ONE knows what you did...aha...that...is Jesus in you.
Praise Him!!
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/6/2008 8:31:38 PM
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PopsiLufsJesus
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you just told us what your right hand was doing...
_____________________________
Then He said to His disciples, “The harvest truly is plentiful, but the laborers are few. Therefore pray the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into His harvest.” ~Matthew 9:37-38 
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 2:11:43 AM
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kisstheson
Posts: 965
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I am in the middle of a fast-paced, upwardly mobile metropolis. But tonight I stop, study the cross and kneel in shame for so quickly forgetting. This cross, like a wedding band, bonds me forever in love. I am loved. I am loved enough for Roman execution on a rocky, skull-shaped hill.
_____________________________
This is my Beloved. This is my friend. (Song of Solomon)
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 3:43:10 AM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 3396
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quote:
you just told us what your right hand was doing...
Nope. I didn't tell ya what I did...I just said I did something...
quote:
But tonight I stop, study the cross and kneel in shame for so quickly forgetting. This cross, like a wedding band, bonds me forever in love. I am loved. I am loved enough for Roman execution on a rocky, skull-shaped hill.
While there is nothing wrong with this, it begs the question...if you lose your cross or wedding ring do you lose your salvation or marriage?
Obviously not, but it shines light on the true glue in our relationships...not what you see, but who you are...or better put, who your Master is.
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 4:10:02 AM
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OLEEguacamole
Posts: 1069
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
Perhaps those churches that don't display the crosses have done some studying that has changed their minds about using them. The fact is that anyone can die on a cross: Messiah was one among thousands who did. But there is only one who ever arose from the grave, after three days in it, by His own volition, to walk the earth, then ascend to the Father by His own will, and remain there with wounds in His hands and feet. Therefore, perhaps they should take the idea someone mentioned earlier in your thread: display the empty tomb rather than a cross.
i grew up hearing that the non crucifix style cross was a representation of Jesus not staying on the cross/dead.
it was not just the resurrection that validates the work on the cross, it was Jesus, divine incarnate. perfect sacrifice. further if Jesus had died of a heart attack or other natural causes, there would have been no work of reconciliation.
"worthy is the Lamb that was slain" is not a concept that expired.
_____________________________
there's life in a pit.
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 6:06:24 AM
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flowerhugger
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I suppose it all depends on your motives, which no one else can accurately judge. I love crosses. It reminds me of what HE did for me, it also lets others know I am not ashamed to admitt I am a Christian. Sometimes wearing a tee-shirt or having a bumper sticker that "Advertises Jesus" causes people to strike up a conversation with you. Sometimes it just says what you would like the whole world to know. It isn't always a fake thing or a brag. Wearing a Coors Beer tee shirt simply tells people what you are into, Wearing a cross can do the same. The same person who would be offended that someone was "TOO friendly" would probably also be offended if they weren't. I person wearing a cross but not "Acting" like a Christian is still a human being probably trying to do the best they know how. You don't know where they used to be. We are all in a state of growing and changing if we are allowing Christ to work in our life. Lets give each other some grace and mercy.
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THE COVE ISBN # 978-60647-330-6
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 6:09:48 AM
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kisstheson
Posts: 965
Joined: 5/1/2006
From: AOL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SonInMe1
quote:
you just told us what your right hand was doing...
Nope. I didn't tell ya what I did...I just said I did something...
quote:
But tonight I stop, study the cross and kneel in shame for so quickly forgetting. This cross, like a wedding band, bonds me forever in love. I am loved. I am loved enough for Roman execution on a rocky, skull-shaped hill.
While there is nothing wrong with this, it begs the question...if you lose your cross or wedding ring do you lose your salvation or marriage?
Obviously not, but it shines light on the true glue in our relationships...not what you see, but who you are...or better put, who your Master is.
Why can't you just let the beauty of the statement stand? Why do you even have to beg the question? It's like you're going to a wedding ceremony and asking, "what's the big deal about the wedding ring? Like, why do we even have to wear it to symbolize our love?"
this trivalizing the cross by Christains grieves me so much...you have no idea. If Jesus handed me the symbol of His love I wouldn't say, "no thanks. You know i already love you in my heart."
_____________________________
This is my Beloved. This is my friend. (Song of Solomon)
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 6:20:53 AM
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kisstheson
Posts: 965
Joined: 5/1/2006
From: AOL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: OLEEguacamole
quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
Perhaps those churches that don't display the crosses have done some studying that has changed their minds about using them. The fact is that anyone can die on a cross: Messiah was one among thousands who did. But there is only one who ever arose from the grave, after three days in it, by His own volition, to walk the earth, then ascend to the Father by His own will, and remain there with wounds in His hands and feet. Therefore, perhaps they should take the idea someone mentioned earlier in your thread: display the empty tomb rather than a cross.
i grew up hearing that the non crucifix style cross was a representation of Jesus not staying on the cross/dead.
it was not just the resurrection that validates the work on the cross, it was Jesus, divine incarnate. perfect sacrifice. further if Jesus had died of a heart attack or other natural causes, there would have been no work of reconciliation.
"worthy is the Lamb that was slain" is not a concept that expired.
That's right! The concept certainly HAS NOT expired! I wonder why people ignore verses like, "I want to know Christ and the fellowship of His sufferings." and "I preach Christ and Him crucified." I'll say it again...its only in this generation that Christians haven't cherished the mesage of the cross and want to quickly skip to the message of the resurrection. I would say much more about it but it frankly makes me so mad to hear His people talking like this. its as though they are saying to Christ..."I don't want to think of Your sufferings too much. I much rather think of the triumph. Lets move along." How can people show such ingratitude for what Christ did?
_____________________________
This is my Beloved. This is my friend. (Song of Solomon)
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 11:10:47 AM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 3396
Joined: 4/16/2005
From: my mom by God
Status: offline
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quote:
Why can't you just let the beauty of the statement stand
This is a forum. If you do not care to have your thoughts challeneged then feel free to blog.
I did not question your passion. All I did was question what I have questioned since the beginning of this thread...the need of an idol in our relationship with God.
quote:
This cross, like a wedding band, bonds me forever in love.
This disturbs me. It does beg the question I asked.
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 12:37:13 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3640
Joined: 6/8/2005
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What amazes me the most in this thread is this: that someone would say, "This is what I do; therefore, you should do the same, and if you don't, you do not represent Messiah. I, then, am holier than thou."
I could not care less that you use a cross. I work for a church that displays one on its steeple, in its auditorium, in its narthex, and in the pastor's office. So what. That's what some churches do.
I could not care less that you wear a cross. I see that all the time -- some on believers, some on the ignorant, some on pagans, and some on Wiccans.
That I don't use crosses or wear them does not change my relationship with my L-rd. That I will not bow to a cross is also between me and my Messiah and does not change my relationship with my L-rd to something less. I need no image to represent Him, especially when He cautioned us repeatedly about images.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 1:11:10 PM
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PopsiLufsJesus
Posts: 5074
Joined: 5/6/2008
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He lives inside of me! What more I could need?
_____________________________
Then He said to His disciples, “The harvest truly is plentiful, but the laborers are few. Therefore pray the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into His harvest.” ~Matthew 9:37-38
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RE: Christians dissing the cross - 9/7/2008 8:39:24 PM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 3396
Joined: 4/16/2005
From: my mom by God
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Paul said that food restrictions were of a lesser faith. He did not say they were wrong...He defined them as having less faith.
The jews would have physical reminders of their relationship with God on their person.
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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