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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/10/2008 11:41:43 AM
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peculiar_lady2
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quote:
For those of you who have children who are over-emotional at times... if your child is throwing a tantrum that lasts more than a few minutes, don't you think it's best to remove them from the situation, at least long enough to attempt to calm down? It really depends on the child and the reason they are upset. (and thanks for starting a new thread for this one). My oldest gets upset very easily...he is on the autistic spectrum and some things (change from the norm) he just simply can't handle...ever. So us leaving a store when he was little would not have solved the problem. We had to expose him to situations that we and he couldn't control...and over time it got easier. Now he is 9yo and the normal places we go all the time he can handle well (grocery store, park, church, restaurant, museum, library). When we go someplace new we expect some upset from him still. What helps the most now is that he is old enough for us to say "we are doing this different then we have in the past" and give him a heads up about what changes may occur. One example of something he still can't handle would be in church...if for some reason they don't have class and the kids stay in the service, he usually gets overwhelmed with the situation very easily and can't handle it and at times freaks out. For our oldest we really have to assess the situation, his level of trepidation, our own patience, the specific place we are, and decide if it's worth it at that time to make him deal with whatever he has to deal with. Sometimes it is best to stay, sometimes it is best to go (and if necessary come back later alone).
our second doesn't really care...she is just laid back (personality wise) and chit chats her way through life. She takes change very well, doesn't really get upset at things...just easy going.
Our third is not autistic, but she has some of the same qualities of our oldest...she is exactly like my mom, has absolutely NO sense of humor, and because of her age, can easily get overwhelmed. We have to deal with her very different then our oldest though...with her no amount of exposing her to the situation will make her comfortable with it...we just simply have to wait it out and let her come to be ok with it on her own.
Our fourth is very much like our second...just happy go lucky getting through life.
as for the store, there have been many times that I chose to "ride it out" and get the basics we needed then get out as quickly as I could. However I have never chosen to do so with a child that was literally screaming and that I can't get to stop screaming...baby, yes...child, no. (I nurse, so sometimes babies scream when they want to eat, and sometimes that is even in a store...I usually console as best I can and get to the van where I can nurse them). I have been known to push my cart to the front, ask that they keep it there for me, take the kid home, then come back to finish. I have also been known to push my cart to the front, apologize profusely for the extra trouble, and ask them to please return that stuff to the shelf because I couldn't just take the child home and come back. I have also been known to "put up with it" and just get the trip over with as quickly as possible.
When we lived in Germany though there were many times that I couldn't "just leave" though. 1, we didn't have a vehicle so we relied on public transportation or taxi's both of which took time...2, we couldn't just get a bus any day, they were only available during the week, not weekends, so we had to plan that too...3, we couldn't just stand outside in the snow waiting for whatever form we were taking to get home, at least not when it was that cold, because sometimes it would be an hour or more til we could leave. So in those conditions it was best that I just finish shopping during that time.
One thing I refuse to put up with from my ki8ds is this kind of behavior in a restaurant....in a store, if necessary, someone else or me can walk away, but in a restaurant others (and myself) are stuck there to listen to it.....so in that kind of situation I will leave with my child. We are very strict with manners and restaurant appropriateness...and we tell our kids out in the van before we even go in how things are going to go...we do not just sit there letting them run wild or scream. I can't remember any of my kids ever "running wild" in a restaurant...and screaming warrants a trip to the restroom or the van (btdt many times).
Anyway...it isn't always so cut and dry, even though we would like it to be.
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/10/2008 11:49:59 AM
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Mrs.X
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My oldest (almost 3) gets upset very easily, but it doesn't last long at all, unless we're stuck in line and the thing he wants is right there, then he'll continue kicking the buggy and crying until we check out and the item is out of sight.
If it lasted a long time, I probably would try to take him outside or to a quiet department and calm him down. Some kids can't be calmed down though, yeah even mentally healthy kids.
That mom might have known that she couldn't calm her kid down, so she didn't even bother. Or, maybe ignoring has worked in the past for her, but just not this time because he was hungry or needed a nap or something like that.
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From Sweet Grass to the Packin' House
A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger. -Proverbs 15:1
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/10/2008 12:08:54 PM
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Jenny-Fair
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quote:
I also don't like my shopping disrupted for a full half hour or longer As I said in the other thread, for one of my kids, leaving would be the best lesson. For the other, leaving would encourage future public outbursts.
So, thinking long-term, shopping for 45 minutes (and, come on, as a single mom of two, who else was going to buy the groceries?) while holding Nate in a sitting position in the cart with one hand and shopping with the other, while he screamed because he wanted to stand in the cart may have been miserable for Nate, me, and the other shoppers...but it was the last grocery-store fit he ever threw, and he wasn't even two yet! So I saved us and our future co-shoppers a lot of grief.
Oh, and he would have calmed down, all right...until I told him he had to sit in the cart again. Then he'd merely have started over.
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/10/2008 12:19:40 PM
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OneOfHisJewels
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quote:
our second doesn't really care...she is just laid back (personality wise) and chit chats her way through life. She takes change very well, doesn't really get upset at things...just easy going.
Our third is not autistic, but she has some of the same qualities of our oldest...she is exactly like my mom, has absolutely NO sense of humor, and because of her age, can easily get overwhelmed. We have to deal with her very different then our oldest though...with her no amount of exposing her to the situation will make her comfortable with it...we just simply have to wait it out and let her come to be ok with it on her own.
Slightly off topic, but weren't they the other way around as babies...wasn't Hannah the fussy baby who hated being a baby, and Emma the "lethargic" baby? Funny how they change as they come out of their babyhood...
or am I just gettting mixed up?
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-Mrs. Wifey
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/10/2008 12:21:19 PM
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Sideways
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Sarah is right about the difference between a store and a restaurant or some other place of ease and recreation. If I paid good money to see a movie or a concert, I don't someone's kid ruining it for me, no matter what their particular situation.
At a grocery store? Eh, I can move to a different aisle, and I understand that people need to eat, so it may not be an option for some parents to just walk out with 3 kids and come back at a later date.
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/10/2008 6:14:10 PM
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garsyt
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I'm one of those where it depends on the child and the situation and setting as well. It also bears well to remember that what looks like a fit is not always a tantrum.
For example I was told to shut my child up when we were waiting at the pharmacy one time. I had all four of my kids with me and they were all 7 and younger and two of them were miserable with ear infections. We had come straight from the dr's office to the pharmacy and I just couldn't leave any of them with a sitter because there were none available. So yes they were miserable and crying and fussy, but I had no choice. And there was NO way I was going to discipline a child because they were in pain. That makes no sense. My two healthy children were perfect when we were there. It's also happened that my kids were accused of being little brats when there was absolutely NO cause for it.
Now we live 10 miles from the closest grocery shopping. When I go I don't leave til I get everything on the list REGARDLESS. I simply can't. So I plan my trips, hopefully at good times. It's better now that they are all older, but when they were younger sometimes there were issues. With one of my kids, like Jenny, if I left he would have won and not learned, he would have gotten just what he wanted. So I would strap him into the cart when he was younger or he would be required to sit in the basket. He had a few tantrums but they eventually subsided. He never through a tantrum in church, unless he was having an allergic reaction to something, which was common in one of our churches til we figured out the problem and were able to remedy it.
With the other kids removing them from the situation even if just for a few minutes or a sharp whisper in the ear would settle them down really quickly.
Typically if those three ever had a major tantrum outside of the home it was because they were ill or something else was direly wrong.
I don't like making others listen to my kids throw a fit, but at the same time all I ask for is a little understanding and compassion. Parenting isn't easy and any parent that says that their children never have or would never do something are either lying or very mistaken, or simply not willing to admit that children are not robots but living breathing human beings with minds and personalities of their own.
Blessings,
Garsy
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 12:14:11 AM
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SweetPea213
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Mrs.X
My oldest (almost 3) gets upset very easily, but it doesn't last long at all, unless we're stuck in line and the thing he wants is right there, then he'll continue kicking the buggy and crying until we check out and the item is out of sight.
If it lasted a long time, I probably would try to take him outside or to a quiet department and calm him down. Some kids can't be calmed down though, yeah even mentally healthy kids.
That mom might have known that she couldn't calm her kid down, so she didn't even bother. Or, maybe ignoring has worked in the past for her, but just not this time because he was hungry or needed a nap or something like that.
Yes but, just becuase you are stuck listening to your kid cry, scream, yell or just break the sound barrier in general, does not mean you have to subject everyone else to it!
_____________________________
"He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed." ~ 1 Peter 2:24
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 12:26:25 AM
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SweetPea213
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quote:
ORIGINAL: garsyt
For example I was told to shut my child up when we were waiting at the pharmacy one time. I had all four of my kids with me and they were all 7 and younger and two of them were miserable with ear infections. We had come straight from the dr's office to the pharmacy and I just couldn't leave any of them with a sitter because there were none available. So yes they were miserable and crying and fussy, but I had no choice. And there was NO way I was going to discipline a child because they were in pain. That makes no sense.
I don't like making others listen to my kids throw a fit, but at the same time all I ask for is a little understanding and compassion. Parenting isn't easy
Blessings,
Garsy
1). Incident at the Pharmacy--If your child is screaming at the top of their little lungs, and is clearly being a HUGE annoynace to the others around you, then it is YOUR job as the parent to shut the kid up, regardless of the cause. Child hurting or not, pain is not an excuse to let your kid act out in public.
2). "Parenting isn't easy"--Actually it is, a parents job is guided entirely upon God given instincts.
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"He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed." ~ 1 Peter 2:24
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 12:28:16 AM
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Jenny-Fair
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Do you HAVE kids? In the pharmacy incident, she'd have had to resort to abusive behavior. What a dumb thing to suggest--shut the kid up at all costs. For pity's sake, kids are people, too, you know.
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Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 12:42:59 AM
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narnia
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quote:
then it is YOUR job as the parent to shut the kid up, regardless of the cause.
Hmmm..is that what Jesus would do?
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 12:44:33 AM
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SweetPea213
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair
Do you HAVE kids? In the pharmacy incident, she'd have had to resort to abusive behavior. What a dumb thing to suggest--shut the kid up at all costs. For pity's sake, kids are people, too, you know.
If you want to listen to your kids tantrums at home or in your car, then by all means do so. But out in public with other people--when's its not just you and your angelic, can't-do-no-wrong darlings--then yes, shut them up or at the very LEAST make them be quiter. When I'm at the store, a restaraunt, library, movie, wherever, just trying to have a good peaceful time, I do not want to be bothered by some screaming kid(s) and their seemingly oblivious parents.
as well.
You don't need to have a kid to know how to raise one. It's all God given instincts and common sense. Unfortunately, not everyone has the latter.
_____________________________
"He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed." ~ 1 Peter 2:24
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 12:47:20 AM
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Jenny-Fair
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Common sense and my god-given instincts tell me that a child in pain that can only be cured by medications that I have to get from the pharmacist, may have to bother others while I am waiting for the pharmacist to give me the meds.
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Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 12:52:25 AM
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OneOfHisJewels
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quote:
2). "Parenting isn't easy"--Actually it is, a parents job is guided entirely upon God given instincts.
WHAT??????? I don't even have kids, and I know parenting isn't easy..it's a 24 hour a day commitment...teaching, guiding, buying groceries, cooking meals, supporting the family, buying their clothes and toys, changing their diapers, either home schooling or transporting them to and from school and helping with their homework...doing their laundry, dealing with their moods, and once a parent has more than one dealing with all the interpersonal relationships and conflicts between siblings, if they're babies feeding them, bath times, hair cuts, if they're involved in any activities transporting them to them..when they're sick cleaning up their throw up, keeping track of their shots...I could go on and on...
parenting may be rewarding, but it is NOT easy..
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"We basically use what I have seen referred to as "get off your butt" parenting. It employs more interaction, more redirection, more prevention, and usually less spanking."
-Mrs. Wifey
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 12:53:20 AM
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Mrs.Wifey
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SweetPea213
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair
Do you HAVE kids? In the pharmacy incident, she'd have had to resort to abusive behavior. What a dumb thing to suggest--shut the kid up at all costs. For pity's sake, kids are people, too, you know.
If you want to listen to your kids tantrums at home or in your car, then by all means do so. But out in public with other people--when's its not just you and your angelic, can't-do-no-wrong darlings--then yes, shut them up or at the very LEAST make them be quiter. When I'm at the store, a restaraunt, library, movie, wherever, just trying to have a good peaceful time, I do not want to be bothered by some screaming kid(s) and their seemingly oblivious parents.
as well.
You don't need to have a kid to know how to raise one. It's all God given instincts and common sense. Unfortunately, not everyone has the latter.
Trust me, we aren't oblivious. In fact, we're probably quite embarrassed that our child is making such a scene.
Perhaps I should carry some duct-tape in my purse? I'm sure a strip of that over the kid's mouth would shut them right up and make you happy.
There isn't always the perfect time to have a screaming child. Sometimes it happens at the checkout, like Christina said, and I am certainly not going to put my entire cart of food back so that I can leave and give you some peace. Yes, parenting involves common sense but it also involves grace- alot more of which some people could extend to parents.
< Message edited by Mrs.Wifey -- 9/11/2008 12:59:24 AM >
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 12:59:28 AM
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Jenny-Fair
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I used to work at a fabric store. There was a mom who shopped there frequently who had two kids (she has three now and is still shopping there, I simply am not subjected to it).
On the way in the door, she would hand her boys a large candy bar, off of our rack, prior to paying for it, in the hopes that they would then be quit for the rest of her trip.
This resulted in two bratty boys who only had to whine in order for their mother to give in (you know, to avoid a scene), who left sticky handprints on $20/yd fabric, and this was clearly not good parenting.
But, I guess I should say...at least they were quiet so Tigger's shopping trip wasn't blighted by the sound of normal children?
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 1:02:14 AM
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OneOfHisJewels
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From: California
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Mrs.Wifey
quote:
ORIGINAL: SweetPea213
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair
Do you HAVE kids? In the pharmacy incident, she'd have had to resort to abusive behavior. What a dumb thing to suggest--shut the kid up at all costs. For pity's sake, kids are people, too, you know.
If you want to listen to your kids tantrums at home or in your car, then by all means do so. But out in public with other people--when's its not just you and your angelic, can't-do-no-wrong darlings--then yes, shut them up or at the very LEAST make them be quiter. When I'm at the store, a restaraunt, library, movie, wherever, just trying to have a good peaceful time, I do not want to be bothered by some screaming kid(s) and their seemingly oblivious parents.
as well.
You don't need to have a kid to know how to raise one. It's all God given instincts and common sense. Unfortunately, not everyone has the latter.
Trust me, we aren't oblivious. In fact, we're probably quite embarrassed that our child is making such a scene.
Perhaps I should carry some duct-tape in my purse? I'm sure a strip of that over the kid's mouth would shut them right up and make you happy.
Well, if I was around any of your kids, you wouldn't have to be embarrassed..I understand kids are kids and parents are just doing the best they can...I've been known to start entertaining a kid on an airplane, and I've smiled and waved at kids in the grocery store. When I hear a kid fussing or whatever, it hardly even fazes(sp) me..I figure there's a reason and the parents are taking care of it...I'm glad we live in a society where there are children around....I'd much rather be in the U.S. and hear a baby fuss once in a while then be in some society where I only saw adults. That would be sad. A relative of mine visited a country I will not name, and one of her favorite parts about the visit was that she never heard a crying child  . Later, I learned that in that country many of the children are sold into brothels.  It's bad enough so much of society is killing babies through abortion, I'd hate to see us start banning babies. We ALL have our fits...it's just that adults can hide them and have them inwardly..babies can't..And we were all babies and children once ourselves.
< Message edited by OneOfHisJewels -- 9/11/2008 1:22:47 AM >
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"We basically use what I have seen referred to as "get off your butt" parenting. It employs more interaction, more redirection, more prevention, and usually less spanking."
-Mrs. Wifey
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 1:32:13 AM
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locomom
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SweetPea213,
Either you've had compliant children or no children. Children are childish. That means they will behave childishly, sometimes quite noticeably to others. One thing as a parent you cannot do is turn your child on and off as you wish. Now some of them it takes very little correction, but they aren't all like that. Some of them are loud and long with their tempers. I had one of those. It had no off switch because it took years for her to learn to choose better behavior. We certainly didn't ignore it wherever we were. Or do you not know any adults who are still having to master their tempers. Certainly book of James says a good bit about tempers.
Tempers, we all have them! Including adults. Children behave inconveniently. Sometimes you can leave the situation, but occasionally you just can't. That latter includes the pharmacy trip to get medication for painful infections. A mom cannot do everything to please everything around her.
Last, God's word is a great help in parenting, but you are greatly mistaken if you ever think parenting is easy. It is the hardest job you can ever have!
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 7:24:31 AM
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Sideways
Posts: 3629
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: OneOfHisJewels
I'm glad we live in a society where there are children around....I'd much rather be in the U.S. and hear a baby fuss once in a while then be in some society where I only saw adults. That would be sad.
I will say that in Germany, you don't see children as much, in places that are geared towards adults. Small children generally aren't seen in nice restaurants, late night movies or a formal concert. It's not because the Germans don't love their children, they just don't take children at an even where adult behavior is expected, when children are not capable of adult behavior.
Of course you see children at basic shopping areas, but that's completely different. I think the Germans have the right idea. They take good care of their children and they do discipline, but if they are going to the theater, they hire a sitter or stay at home when the kids are small.
Children have their place, except here in America, where their place is everywhere. 
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RE: Non-Parent Opinion on Temper Tantrums - 9/11/2008 7:34:55 AM
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Sideways
Posts: 3629
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Mrs.Wifey
Trust me, we aren't oblivious. In fact, we're probably quite embarrassed that our child is making such a scene.
At the grocery store or pharmacy? Don't feel embarrassed around me, Ryanne. I'd feel sympathy more then anything else. At the library? Well, if it's the kid section at the library, I wouldn't mind, after all the section is for children.
Now, even at a casual pizza place, there was once a toddler who was repeatedly banging his spoon (loudly) against a wooden table. Even though this was not a nice restaurant by any stretch, it still got annoying after a while. Sure he wasn't crying, but by that point, I was so irritated by the unending banging, that I would've almost rather listened to him screaming. I did stand up and loudly asked the mom to please control her child and stop him from banging on the table.
He didn't cry; she did stop him, and we ate our dinner in peace. But I probably should've said something before I allowed myself to get so upset.
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