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[Poll]
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Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative?
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| Both - depends on the issue |
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| I don't know |
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Total Votes : 32
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(last vote on : 10/12/2008 8:42:10 PM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 8:00:29 AM
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mapachito13
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There are many disaffected Republicans/conservatives that seem to turn to the Libertarian party for someone to back for their political views. But many planks in their platform seem very liberal to me. A couple of those planks that are liberal I have cut and pasted from their website.
"1.2 Personal Privacy
We support the protections provided by the Fourth Amendment to be secure in our persons, homes, and property. Only actions that infringe on the rights of others can properly be termed crimes. We favor the repeal of all laws creating "crimes" without victims, such as the use of drugs for medicinal or recreational purposes.
1.3 Personal Relationships
Sexual orientation, preference, gender, or gender identity should have no impact on the rights of individuals by government, such as in current marriage, child custody, adoption, immigration or military service laws. Consenting adults should be free to choose their own sexual practices and personal relationships. Government does not have the authority to define, license or restrict personal relationships.
1.4 Abortion
Recognizing that abortion is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on all sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration." Platform of Libertarian Party
Now when it comes to the second amendment, they take a very conservative position.
What's your view?
_____________________________
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"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Pakistan or Afghanistan, but our own fiscal irresponsibility."-David Walker, fmr comptroller general of the US
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 9:07:31 AM
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AdrianaS
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I went for the both option...as I do not know much.
I kind of like very much Ron Paul speaking few weeks back at C-SPAN..it seems that he is conservative and I did agree about his international policies, his standings about the war and about Federal Reserve, although I did not have opportunity to get to know much about the issues..but than I was derailed from embracing him as some people pointed out somethings he embraces about conspiracy theories etc
I am pro-3rd and beyond parties, that I'm sure. 
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 9:32:03 AM
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fiat_lux
Posts: 283
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From: Ottawa
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quote:
What's your view?
I'm not sure whether trying to package them as liberal or conservative is fair to them or to liberals or to conservatives. Libertarians usually aren't making moral judgements about whether it's right to do, for example, some of those "crimes without victims" things. They just argue that there's only a very narrow range of criminal activity which is so severe that we need big government to come in and enforce laws on those issues. The general theme is smaller government, not less morals.
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 9:38:43 AM
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mrtigger
Posts: 299
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The main emphasis of Libertarians is personal liberty with the absolute minimum government required to assure that liberty. Sometimes that view winds up coinciding with the 'liberal' view, sometimes with the 'conservative'.
I'm registered Libertarian. I don't agree with all Libertarian positions but Libertarian ideals are a lot closer to my own than either the Republicans or Democrats.
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mr tigger
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 3:38:28 PM
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DaveW
Posts: 4098
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Actually they are anarchic, neither liberal or conservative.
I spoke to one of their stumpers a few years back and asked him what the ultimate vision was. It was to fire every public servant and then quit leaving no government at all, no courts no police no legislators no military.
_____________________________
Avatar is Saphira 5 months and Louvena at 23 months!
We are now grandparents TWICE!!
====================================
Our CD is now available here:
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 3:41:26 PM
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rcjames
Posts: 5658
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Well they are definately for Choice in the Killing of the unborn; so that says Liberal to the max.
Least we forget they are for the legalization of drugs also.
Shame on them.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
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Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 5:40:45 PM
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rgsoundguy
Posts: 398
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Pottstown, PA
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The word "conservative" has been hijacked by social moralists and further perverted by the left. Conservative is nothing more that a word that descibes "limited government." Anyone who seeks to moral value on another person or group of people is not a conservative, but a social moralist. Many Christians will question a person who does not subcribe to that mentality. I would however like to ask you this. Does banning gay marriage stop people from being gay? No. The only thing that can stop a person from being gay is the irristable Grace of Jesus Christ. Does outlawing Drugs and Prostitution do anything to prevent them? No, and in many cases it makes the situation worse. By cutting off the drug supply the costs are high and drugs are more potent. This is precisely what happened during prohibition. Bootleggers were pushing hard liquor, not beer because there was a greater profit in the thing that will cause intoxication with less. Organized crime had an outlet as well. Today, drug dealers are more inclined to sell hardcore drugs like cocaine or heroine because they can make greater profits off of them. Also, addicts are addicted to drugs they can not afford so they resort to crimes against innocent people such as theft and even murder just to get some money for their fix. Many addicts will even resort to prostitution as a way to support their habit. I am in no way promoting drug use, but a more responsible drug policy.
The area where I disagree with the Libertarian Party, and the reason I am registered independent and identify myself as a libertarian (small L) is the issue of abortion. I believe they have this area wrong, although they will not allow for any government funding of this atrocity, they don't protect the most basic form of liberty. I believe that life begins at conception. I may or may not be able to prove that, but I can certainly say that it can not be conclusively proven that life does not begin at conception. The Declaration of Independence says that we are "Endowed by our Creator, with certain unalienable rights, Life, Liberty, and the Persuit of Happiness." That is what the Libertarian Party bases its platform on. If I am incorrect about life beginning at conception, I would would rather make an error that protects life. There is a sect of the Libertarians that are called, the Libertarians for Life. They are Libertarians who seek to protect the unborn.
Now, I know that the responses are coming. Please pick apart my statements. Just have patience with me as I try to address all your comments.
_____________________________
Albert Einstein said that insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. That convinces me that our nation is insane because we continually elect republicans and democrats expecting change and get none.
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 5:46:28 PM
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rlj
Posts: 2171
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I never could get into the Libertarian Party because of the fact that their stance on pro choice, drugs and personal relationships doesn't take those decisions out of the hands of government but empowers the government to enforce those decisions on everyone. For a party that claims "liberty" the feds sure do seem to get more power to make decisions for myself and for those around me. They are every bit as guilty of butchering the 10th amendment as the other 2 parties.
_____________________________
-Roger
This is who I'm voting for. He is from the same party I voted for last time. This is consistent with my belief in the failure of the two party system and my disgust with it.
http://www.baldwin08.com/#
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 8:35:07 PM
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cog41
Posts: 616
Joined: 7/16/2006
From: The Great State of Texas
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There are quite a number of prolife Libertarians. The general platform may indicate otherwise, but most I have talked to believe the issue should be left to the states and not the federal govt.
As for legalization of drugs, it can be argued that our "war" on drugsin the present form does not work. We spend right at $18 billion a year on this "war" and for what? Don't get me wrong, I'm not for totally legalizingdrugs but we have to look at some other methods or approach.
Private relationships, well I don't believe they're for the gay agenda but it to should be left to the states.
Less govt to them means govt in any form,local,county,state,federal. Most of all Federal. And if you look at our system today it isn't hard to see that most everyone wants Big Bro Fedzilla to handle everything.
Libertarians and repub conservatives would do well to unite and get the word out.
_____________________________
Psalm 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: "May they prosper who love you."
Hook'em Horns! Roll Tide!
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 9:58:08 PM
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rgsoundguy
Posts: 398
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Pottstown, PA
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rlj
I never could get into the Libertarian Party because of the fact that their stance on pro choice, drugs and personal relationships doesn't take those decisions out of the hands of government but empowers the government to enforce those decisions on everyone. For a party that claims "liberty" the feds sure do seem to get more power to make decisions for myself and for those around me. They are every bit as guilty of butchering the 10th amendment as the other 2 parties.
By your definition then, something has to be enforced. Legalizing drugs would free up law enforcement to actually protect you and not be busy busting somebody just for possession. As I stated above, I am with you on the pro-choice thing. And for the personal relationships, what is it doing to stop people from being gay? Nothing. Truth be told, and I fall into this category, many libertarians want the government out of marriage period. I made my vow to my wife and to God, but for some reason the State of New Jersey was involved. I don't need a government to recognize my marriage and I think marriage licenses should be done away with. Make the spiritual institution in was meant to be. And I know what people are going to say, it's for wills and what not. Well, show some responsibility and spell out the details of said marriage in a contract and everybody should have a will. That's just common sense and personal responsibility.
_____________________________
Albert Einstein said that insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. That convinces me that our nation is insane because we continually elect republicans and democrats expecting change and get none.
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 10:24:31 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
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They are generally for unlawfulness...
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Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 10:30:10 PM
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rgsoundguy
Posts: 398
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Pottstown, PA
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
They are generally for unlawfulness...
Says who? They are for laws the way they should be. They don't think theft should be illegal, rape, etc. Yes there are the lunatic fringe that think it's their anarchist outlet, but they are just the fringe.
_____________________________
Albert Einstein said that insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. That convinces me that our nation is insane because we continually elect republicans and democrats expecting change and get none.
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 10:34:46 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rgsoundguy
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
They are generally for unlawfulness...
Says who? They are for laws the way they should be. They don't think theft should be illegal, rape, etc. Yes there are the lunatic fringe that think it's their anarchist outlet, but they are just the fringe.
Says those who want to legalize drugs and have no issue with the 3500 murdered unborn children daily... And for the most part the party doesn't reject the fringe...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/29/2008 11:41:51 PM
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mapachito13
Posts: 2499
Joined: 10/1/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cog41
Private relationships, well I don't believe they're for the gay agenda but it to should be left to the states.
quote:
1.3 Personal Relationships
Sexual orientation, preference, gender, or gender identity should have no impact on the rights of individuals by government, such as in current marriage, child custody, adoption, immigration or military service laws. Consenting adults should be free to choose their own sexual practices and personal relationships. Government does not have the authority to define, license or restrict personal relationships.
Sexual orientation or gender identity includes homosexuals, transexuals and transgender persons. This very liberal plank from their platform is one of the reasons why conservatives AREN"T signing on in droves. Their pro-choice plank is another.
This is why I said both. It seems they take from the extremes of both sides, IMO.
_____________________________
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Pakistan or Afghanistan, but our own fiscal irresponsibility."-David Walker, fmr comptroller general of the US
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 12:11:22 AM
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rlj
Posts: 2171
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quote:
By your definition then, something has to be enforced. Legalizing drugs would free up law enforcement to actually protect you and not be busy busting somebody just for possession. As I stated above, I am with you on the pro-choice thing. And for the personal relationships, what is it doing to stop people from being gay? Nothing. Truth be told, and I fall into this category, many libertarians want the government out of marriage period. I made my vow to my wife and to God, but for some reason the State of New Jersey was involved. I don't need a government to recognize my marriage and I think marriage licenses should be done away with. Make the spiritual institution in was meant to be. And I know what people are going to say, it's for wills and what not. Well, show some responsibility and spell out the details of said marriage in a contract and everybody should have a will. That's just common sense and personal responsibility.
My opinion on all of those things is found here:
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.
The feds shouldn't tell me that my state has to allow dope smoking, abortion and lower the age of consent to 13 or whatever they want. Those are planks that are to be left up to the individual states. We don't have the freedom to automatically do those things we are supposed to however have the freedom to elect local officials and pass local laws without Washington telling us what we should and should not do. If you're state wishes to allow dope smoking, continue abortion and drop the age of consent to 13 or whatever that is fine. In my state we don't want legal dope, we have the same opinion on pro-life that Dubya has and we don't object to the age of consent being 16. The fed has no business changing that but does now and this wouldn't improve if Liberterians had their way.
_____________________________
-Roger
This is who I'm voting for. He is from the same party I voted for last time. This is consistent with my belief in the failure of the two party system and my disgust with it.
http://www.baldwin08.com/#
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 2:03:19 AM
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FurGodWurLivin
Posts: 954
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From: Kansas City, MO
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From what I have seen, the libertarian party appears to lean more conservatively than liberally, but the reality is that they are more anarchist than anything. There is a reason why the Libertarians were supporting Ron Paul in the republican primary... Ron Paul seemed to think that the government had no business interfering in society at all. However, since holding society together is the purpose of government, I would then ask what purpose the government serves other than to take my money in income taxes.
Adam
_____________________________
I am hyena, Jesus is my Mufasa...
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 6:35:42 AM
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DaveW
Posts: 4098
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From: MD suburbs of Washington DC
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Libertarians see no purpose for any kind of government at any level.
_____________________________
Avatar is Saphira 5 months and Louvena at 23 months!
We are now grandparents TWICE!!
====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 8:52:37 AM
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raivyne
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Extreme Libertarians are anarchist. Not ALL libertarians favor no government. Reasonable people will recognize the need for some form of structure, though they tend to want it to be as basic as possible without promoting chaos. They are economically conservatives (i.e. little restraint on business, little or no income taxes, no nanny state, etc. etc) and socially liberal (no abortion laws or gay marriage laws, little restraints on what adults are allowed to do with their lives). They basically favor whatever keeps the law books to a minimum.
_____________________________
God grades on the cross – not on a curve
Good – God = 0
In the dark? Follow the Son!
The Power of a Simple Gift! samaritanspurse.org
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 9:16:52 AM
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mrtigger
Posts: 299
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There are anarchist and wacko types in the Libertarian party. However Libertarians are not "no government at all" types.
You can read the platform yourself HERE and make your own decision.
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mr tigger
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 10:59:42 AM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 6614
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DaveW
Actually they are anarchic, neither liberal or conservative.
I spoke to one of their stumpers a few years back and asked him what the ultimate vision was. It was to fire every public servant and then quit leaving no government at all, no courts no police no legislators no military.
You are right - and kinder in terms than I would use. I would label them as the Crazy Fringe.
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 12:53:03 PM
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mcleod
Posts: 1071
Joined: 4/4/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
Well they are definately for Choice in the Killing of the unborn; so that says Liberal to the max.
Least we forget they are for the legalization of drugs also.
Shame on them.
Thanks
RC
For one thing they are not into making laws for people to have it their way. I have wrestled with the thing of abortion. It was happening before it was legal. Did not change anything. What needed to happen is that if that person wants to have and is bent on the ideal. Then have them pay for to proceed with the procedure.
Sounds like I don't care about the infants rights. But I do! I just pray that the mother will consider that there is another individual who has rights also. To live and in the pursuit of happeness. Such as she has done.
I pray that USA will change it's way of thinking so that we don't have issues such as this to even exist.
But because we are deprived people we have thoughts on this.
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 12:54:27 PM
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mcleod
Posts: 1071
Joined: 4/4/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rgsoundguy
The word "conservative" has been hijacked by social moralists and further perverted by the left. Conservative is nothing more that a word that descibes "limited government." Anyone who seeks to moral value on another person or group of people is not a conservative, but a social moralist. Many Christians will question a person who does not subcribe to that mentality. I would however like to ask you this. Does banning gay marriage stop people from being gay? No. The only thing that can stop a person from being gay is the irristable Grace of Jesus Christ. Does outlawing Drugs and Prostitution do anything to prevent them? No, and in many cases it makes the situation worse. By cutting off the drug supply the costs are high and drugs are more potent. This is precisely what happened during prohibition. Bootleggers were pushing hard liquor, not beer because there was a greater profit in the thing that will cause intoxication with less. Organized crime had an outlet as well. Today, drug dealers are more inclined to sell hardcore drugs like cocaine or heroine because they can make greater profits off of them. Also, addicts are addicted to drugs they can not afford so they resort to crimes against innocent people such as theft and even murder just to get some money for their fix. Many addicts will even resort to prostitution as a way to support their habit. I am in no way promoting drug use, but a more responsible drug policy.
The area where I disagree with the Libertarian Party, and the reason I am registered independent and identify myself as a libertarian (small L) is the issue of abortion. I believe they have this area wrong, although they will not allow for any government funding of this atrocity, they don't protect the most basic form of liberty. I believe that life begins at conception. I may or may not be able to prove that, but I can certainly say that it can not be conclusively proven that life does not begin at conception. The Declaration of Independence says that we are "Endowed by our Creator, with certain unalienable rights, Life, Liberty, and the Persuit of Happiness." That is what the Libertarian Party bases its platform on. If I am incorrect about life beginning at conception, I would would rather make an error that protects life. There is a sect of the Libertarians that are called, the Libertarians for Life. They are Libertarians who seek to protect the unborn.
Now, I know that the responses are coming. Please pick apart my statements. Just have patience with me as I try to address all your comments.
Yes a big hearty AMEN to this.
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 1:04:13 PM
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raivyne
Posts: 881
Joined: 8/28/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rgsoundguy
The word "conservative" has been hijacked by social moralists and further perverted by the left. Conservative is nothing more that a word that descibes "limited government." Anyone who seeks to moral value on another person or group of people is not a conservative, but a social moralist. Many Christians will question a person who does not subcribe to that mentality. I would however like to ask you this. Does banning gay marriage stop people from being gay? No. The only thing that can stop a person from being gay is the irristable Grace of Jesus Christ. Does outlawing Drugs and Prostitution do anything to prevent them? No, and in many cases it makes the situation worse. By cutting off the drug supply the costs are high and drugs are more potent. This is precisely what happened during prohibition. Bootleggers were pushing hard liquor, not beer because there was a greater profit in the thing that will cause intoxication with less. Organized crime had an outlet as well. Today, drug dealers are more inclined to sell hardcore drugs like cocaine or heroine because they can make greater profits off of them. Also, addicts are addicted to drugs they can not afford so they resort to crimes against innocent people such as theft and even murder just to get some money for their fix. Many addicts will even resort to prostitution as a way to support their habit. I am in no way promoting drug use, but a more responsible drug policy.
The area where I disagree with the Libertarian Party, and the reason I am registered independent and identify myself as a libertarian (small L) is the issue of abortion. I believe they have this area wrong, although they will not allow for any government funding of this atrocity, they don't protect the most basic form of liberty. I believe that life begins at conception. I may or may not be able to prove that, but I can certainly say that it can not be conclusively proven that life does not begin at conception. The Declaration of Independence says that we are "Endowed by our Creator, with certain unalienable rights, Life, Liberty, and the Persuit of Happiness." That is what the Libertarian Party bases its platform on. If I am incorrect about life beginning at conception, I would would rather make an error that protects life. There is a sect of the Libertarians that are called, the Libertarians for Life. They are Libertarians who seek to protect the unborn.
Now, I know that the responses are coming. Please pick apart my statements. Just have patience with me as I try to address all your comments.
I somehow missed this the first time around! Good post :)
_____________________________
God grades on the cross – not on a curve
Good – God = 0
In the dark? Follow the Son!
The Power of a Simple Gift! samaritanspurse.org
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 1:05:41 PM
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HighPlainsDrifter
Posts: 1275
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: The Great Sioux Empire
Status: offline
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I disagree with many opinions presented, and for the most part consider myself a "small l" libertarian. I'd prefer a government who built roads, incarcerated criminals, and killed our foreign enemies as needed. Nothing much else.
_____________________________
Molon Labe
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RE: Is the Libertarian party liberal or conservative? - 9/30/2008 1:06:16 PM
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mcleod
Posts: 1071
Joined: 4/4/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: FurGodWurLivin
From what I have seen, the libertarian party appears to lean more conservatively than liberally, but the reality is that they are more anarchist than anything. There is a reason why the Libertarians were supporting Ron Paul in the republican primary... Ron Paul seemed to think that the government had no business interfering in society at all. However, since holding society together is the purpose of government, I would then ask what purpose the government serves other than to take my money in income taxes.
Adam
To answer that it is by the local goverment to decide in which you are to have your laws governed by. You are probably alot closer to local bodies. Then the slim ball in Washington D.C.
Lord knows can't get the congress person from this area to listen. Even when he has this call on the phone and voice your opinion or questions. He answers or gives statements it like he doesn't even understand.
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