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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 4:49:36 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7784
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From: Lake Wobegon
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quote:
Exactly.
If this cop was threatening to Palin's family why did she let her security staff go? If this cop was abusive to his family, why wasn't there an order of protection filed against him or charges filed. As far as I know a police officer can be fired for abuse, at least in our town they can. Maybe Wasilla is different.
I still say if she would have followed proper procedure this wouldn't be an issue. Which makes me wonder why she didn't. Did she not know what the procedures were or did she know and instead chose to make it personal.
There is no question he was abusive and broke the law on more than one occasion; in this case he was protected by his union and his superior, Monegan - and of course now the liberals who sympathize with him because they hate Palin.
_____________________________
Jack
It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first..
- Ronald Reagan
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 5:00:29 PM
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TaoPoohBear
Posts: 554
Joined: 1/18/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
You can not be that dense!
But obtuse is becoming a distinct possibility!
She was well within her rights to fire a subordinate, she was not within her rights to allow a vendetta against a cop, good or bad.
At least, that's what I got out of it - according to the Branchflower report.
I, personally, think she didn't have a clue what was going on with all the behind the scenes stuff her people (and husband) were doing; That's what makes it bad.
I know you conservatives like less government oversight, but don't you think thats carrying it a little far?!
The entire original case was based on the firing of Monegan; only after it became evident that she was fully in her rights to do so (as you now admit) was there concern about others talking to state officials. And had she not been governor, then there would have been no problem with the same people making the same inquiries (as occurred before she was governor) - of course, then the state officials ignored those inquiries.
So to sum up, the liberal position is, pursuing the removal of bad cops is ok, as long as you are in no position to actually effect the removal of a bad cop.
And this explains why there is still a bad cop on duty in Alaska.
Summing up your conservative view -
It's all right to abuse your authority (or allow others to do it in your name) if you're doing something you believe is right.
(Dick Cheney would be proud)
You do realize that a reasonable request by the Governor ("keep this man as far away from me & mine as possible") would have probably been honored?
Bad people don't get good overnight, let him hang himself.
I will never understand how people can justify bad behavior in the pursuit of justice, when there are so many avenues of good behavior they never pursued that would have achieved better results.
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 5:15:05 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7784
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
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quote:
Summing up your conservative view -
It's all right to abuse your authority (or allow others to do it in your name) if you're doing something you believe is right.
(Dick Cheney would be proud)
Again, how was using one's authority to do what you admit was a good thing, abused? Since when, except by Palin haters, is firing a bad cop a bad thing?
quote:
You do realize that a reasonable request by the Governor ("keep this man as far away from me & mine as possible") would have probably been honored?
Bad people don't get good overnight, let him hang himself.
So what - he was a bad cop - don't you think a bad cop is bad for the community? If the governor cared about her community, wasn't right for her to remove a bad cop? Why are you so supportive of keeping bad cops on the job?
quote:
I will never understand how people can justify bad behavior in the pursuit of justice, when there are so many avenues of good behavior they never pursued that would have achieved better results.
Apparently now we are defining 'bad behavior' as otherwise good behavior by people we don't like.
I will never understand why liberals will accept any behavior by any authority so long as it advances their agenda. The only people who think her behavior was inappropriate are those who hate her.
_____________________________
Jack
It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first..
- Ronald Reagan
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 6:00:25 PM
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TaoPoohBear
Posts: 554
Joined: 1/18/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
Again, how was using one's authority to do what you admit was a good thing, abused? Since when, except by Palin haters, is firing a bad cop a bad thing?
Sure, lets let anyone in public office (and their spouses) pursue justice as they see fit -
Instead of warning the proper chain of command that they will be held responsible for any further actions, just keep harassing them about prior acts.
Justice delayed is justice denied, right?
quote:
You do realize that a reasonable request by the Governor ("keep this man as far away from me & mine as possible") would have probably been honored?
Bad people don't get good overnight, let him hang himself.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
So what - he was a bad cop - don't you think a bad cop is bad for the community? If the governor cared about her community, wasn't right for her to remove a bad cop? Why are you so supportive of keeping bad cops on the job?
Again, proper chain of command. Work with the system you have, not the one you want.
Unless you've got information on this guy even the Alaskan government doesn't have, he wasn't some maniac. And, his prior bad acts had been addressed by his superiors, they were well aware and watchful for the future.
Again, this seems childish - "are we there yet?"
quote:
I will never understand how people can justify bad behavior in the pursuit of justice, when there are so many avenues of good behavior they never pursued that would have achieved better results.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
Apparently now we are defining 'bad behavior' as otherwise good behavior by people we don't like.
I will never understand why liberals will accept any behavior by any authority so long as it advances their agenda. The only people who think her behavior was inappropriate are those who hate her.
What behavior was good about her staff's (and husband's) pursuit of a personal vendetta?!
How you can justify the Palin Administration's behavior on this is beyond chaotic.
The observation that people are not doing their jobs within the confines of their authority is not an agenda, it's an observation.
Defending people who exceed their authority is an agenda.
Is clueless your definition of inappropriate behavior?
Because that's my take on this, she didn't let her people abuse her authority because of personal malice, just ignorance.
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 6:39:56 PM
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stampinlady
Posts: 1539
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Northern IL
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quote:
There is no question he was abusive and broke the law on more than one occasion; in this case he was protected by his union and his superior, Monegan
Please show us proof of this "protection?" She abused her power, period.
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Deb
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 7:21:31 PM
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LivingParadox
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I don't know about anyone else but do you think it's a good idea to keep an abusive cop on the job? That's just common sense to not allow that kind of cop -- and if he's superior was willing to keep him on show his "lack of judgement". Seems pretty simple to us in the normal world.
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 7:38:43 PM
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stampinlady
Posts: 1539
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From: Northern IL
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If he was truely abusive then why wasn't he fired? I just find it interesting that there are all these accusations about what he did, but no charges filed, at least none that I know of. ANd why was her husband involed? Is he being payed by the state like she is, no.
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Deb
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 8:30:31 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
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quote:
ORIGINAL: stampinlady
If he was truely abusive then why wasn't he fired? I just find it interesting that there are all these accusations about what he did, but no charges filed, at least none that I know of.
Are you really asking why bad cops are not sometimes dealt with those who are initially supposed to deal with them?
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 10:16:38 PM
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phosadaud
Posts: 10624
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Washington State
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The only "scandal" I see here is why it took the Governor to get a bad cop off the streets. I'm shocked that no one seems concerned about what was going on that this guy wasn't fired long ago. Anyone who would keep someone like that on patrol, should be fired.
Good for Governor Palin.
_____________________________
~Kristin~
Resume Quotations: "I worked as a Corporate Lesion."
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/13/2008 11:55:43 PM
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StephK
Posts: 2335
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Southwest Louisiana
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quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
The only "scandal" I see here is why it took the Governor to get a bad cop off the streets. I'm shocked that no one seems concerned about what was going on that this guy wasn't fired long ago. Anyone who would keep someone like that on patrol, should be fired.
Good for Governor Palin.
I don't get it either. This nut tasered a kid and was caught drinking and driving while ON DUTY.
_____________________________
Stephanie
The heart of the wise inclines to the right but the heart of the fool to the left.
Even as he walks along the road, the fool lacks sense and shows everyone how stupid he is. ~ Ecc. 10:2-3
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 12:28:13 AM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
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quote:
ORIGINAL: StephK
quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
The only "scandal" I see here is why it took the Governor to get a bad cop off the streets. I'm shocked that no one seems concerned about what was going on that this guy wasn't fired long ago. Anyone who would keep someone like that on patrol, should be fired.
Good for Governor Palin.
I don't get it either. This nut tasered a kid and was caught drinking and driving while ON DUTY.
The real problem is who was this police officer's immediate supervisor and his or she still employed as well...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 12:51:51 PM
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adelphi_sky
Posts: 409
Joined: 10/11/2007
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Palin can lie like the best of them!
Oct. 13: Rachel Re: Even though a bi-partisan panel found that Gov. Sarah Palin abused her power by firing former police commissioner Walt Monegan, she’s telling the media that she was cleared of any wrong doing? Really? Can this be true?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/27171061#27171061
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 12:53:09 PM
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stampinlady
Posts: 1539
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Northern IL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: stampinlady
If he was truely abusive then why wasn't he fired? I just find it interesting that there are all these accusations about what he did, but no charges filed, at least none that I know of.
Are you really asking why bad cops are not sometimes dealt with those who are initially supposed to deal with them?
No, I'm asking where's the proof that this man was so abusive?????? I'm not saying that he wasn't, but did anyone file charges against him? Did family services get involved because of the tazer incindent? I know that cops cover for each other, it happens all the time, but for Palin to be so scared for her family doesn't fly with me.
There are right ways and wrong ways and she chose the wrong way. This man was part of a union and there are procedures to follow before firing someone. Did she make sure these were followed? And why was her husband involved?
If she allows her personaly life to affect her workplace desicions, do you really want her in charge?
_____________________________
Deb
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 12:54:21 PM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 6614
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quote:
ORIGINAL: adelphi_sky
Palin can lie like the best of them!
NEWSFLASH: That doesn't make Obama the better candidate! Fact is, no amount of mud you sling at Palin makes Obama a better candidate than the empty suit he is.
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 1:25:00 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7784
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
Status: offline
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quote:
No, I'm asking where's the proof that this man was so abusive?????? I'm not saying that he wasn't, but did anyone file charges against him? Did family services get involved because of the tazer incindent? I know that cops cover for each other, it happens all the time, but for Palin to be so scared for her family doesn't fly with me.
Who said she was 'scared'; did it occur to you that as a elected representative she might just think it was bad for her community to have this man out there? Here are a few disciplinary memorandums covering a few of his actions.
quote:
There are right ways and wrong ways and she chose the wrong way. This man was part of a union and there are procedures to follow before firing someone. Did she make sure these were followed? And why was her husband involved?
If she allows her personaly life to affect her workplace desicions, do you really want her in charge?
There is no evidence she chose 'the wrong way'. In fact, that is not the finding of the report; the finding is that she didn't sufficiently prevent others from talking to officials. And because of the union, the relatively mild suspension og Wooten (ten days) was lowered to five, which is a travesty that certainly needed rectifying.
_____________________________
Jack
It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first..
- Ronald Reagan
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 1:44:49 PM
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stampinlady
Posts: 1539
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Northern IL
Status: offline
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quote:
From the Branchflower report -
“For the reasons explained in section IV of the report, I find that Governor Sarah Palin abused her power by violating Alaska Statute 39.52.11(a) of the Alaska Executive Branch Ethics Act.
She did nothing wrong????
And did you notice how many of those allegations were either not confirmed or unfounded???
Yes, the guy sounds like a jerk, but ...... . Bringing your personal life into your professional life is asking for trouble. She was wrong.
< Message edited by stampinlady -- 10/14/2008 2:00:17 PM >
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Deb
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 1:47:28 PM
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adelphi_sky
Posts: 409
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
quote:
ORIGINAL: adelphi_sky
Palin can lie like the best of them!
NEWSFLASH: That doesn't make Obama the better candidate! Fact is, no amount of mud you sling at Palin makes Obama a better candidate than the empty suit he is.
That's not mud buddy. That's a fact. If a investigation committee came out with a report that clearly stated Obama was guilty of violating a law or ethics, and he said that SAME report cleared him of any wrongdoing, I'd be the first to say he was lying as well. Until that day comes, Palin outright LIED to your face (by way of the camera  )
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 1:50:42 PM
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FreddieD
Posts: 299
Joined: 7/23/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
NEWSFLASH: That doesn't make Obama the better candidate! Fact is, no amount of mud you sling at Palin makes Obama a better candidate than the empty suit he is.
Than why is Palin slinging mud?
FreddieD
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 2:31:55 PM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 6614
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quote:
ORIGINAL: adelphi_sky
That's not mud buddy. That's a fact. ...
My name's not buddy, sport.
Say it a gazzillion times, but it still will not make Obama any better a candidate than the empty suit he continues to be.
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 2:34:32 PM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 6614
Joined: 4/11/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: FreddieD
quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
NEWSFLASH: That doesn't make Obama the better candidate! Fact is, no amount of mud you sling at Palin makes Obama a better candidate than the empty suit he is.
[unrelated comments edited out]
FreddieD
See post above.
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 2:44:57 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7784
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
Status: offline
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quote:
She did nothing wrong????
And did you notice how many of those allegations were either not confirmed or unfounded???
Yes, the guy sounds like a jerk, but ...... . Bringing your personal life into your professional life is asking for trouble. She was wrong.
She didn't bring her personal life into her professional life; he did, and you are defending him for doing so.
_____________________________
Jack
It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first..
- Ronald Reagan
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 2:54:00 PM
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davemiller7
Posts: 1058
Joined: 3/5/2008
From: NC via NY
Status: online
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Outside of that, how do you feel about the candidates?
quote:
ORIGINAL: ekserekseez
quote:
I find your comments very offensive and sexist. Where's the media covering an Obama supporter supporting sexism?
Oops, your offended! Too bad. Palin's ignorance, and the blind zombielike idolatry of her followers, offends me. And if you think I'm an Obama supporter, you obviously don't know me. I don't support blatant Marxists like Obama, I don't support closet socialists like McCain, and I don't support phony puppet undereducated mediocre nonentities like Palin. Biden isn't even worth mentioning.
OBAMA/BIDEN = SOCIALISM (fast track)
McCAIN/PALIN = SOCIALISM (slow boat)
_____________________________
-Dave
The Prayer of Protection
The light of God surrounds me,
The love of God enfolds me,
The power of God protects me,
The presence of God watches over me.
Wherever I am, God is.
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 3:47:41 PM
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phosadaud
Posts: 10624
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Washington State
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: StephK
quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
The only "scandal" I see here is why it took the Governor to get a bad cop off the streets. I'm shocked that no one seems concerned about what was going on that this guy wasn't fired long ago. Anyone who would keep someone like that on patrol, should be fired.
Good for Governor Palin.
I don't get it either. This nut tasered a kid and was caught drinking and driving while ON DUTY.
The real problem is who was this police officer's immediate supervisor and his or she still employed as well...
Whoever was responsible for relieving this man of his duties and DIDN'T should no longer have a job. Period.
Departments in my area wouldn't NEVER even hire someone who did even half of what he did, let alone keep him on the payroll. Officers are held to extremely high standards of conduct and should be. Trust me - I'm going through the process right now myself.
So again, if no one was addressing the issue and Palin had to step in to make it happen: Go Palin!
_____________________________
~Kristin~
Resume Quotations: "I worked as a Corporate Lesion."
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RE: What is Sarah Palin Hiding? - 10/14/2008 3:59:28 PM
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adelphi_sky
Posts: 409
Joined: 10/11/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: StephK
quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
The only "scandal" I see here is why it took the Governor to get a bad cop off the streets. I'm shocked that no one seems concerned about what was going on that this guy wasn't fired long ago. Anyone who would keep someone like that on patrol, should be fired.
Good for Governor Palin.
I don't get it either. This nut tasered a kid and was caught drinking and driving while ON DUTY.
The real problem is who was this police officer's immediate supervisor and his or she still employed as well...
Whoever was responsible for relieving this man of his duties and DIDN'T should no longer have a job. Period.
Departments in my area wouldn't NEVER even hire someone who did even half of what he did, let alone keep him on the payroll. Officers are held to extremely high standards of conduct and should be. Trust me - I'm going through the process right now myself.
So again, if no one was addressing the issue and Palin had to step in to make it happen: Go Palin!
Unfortunately for Palin, there's an ethical way and an unethical way to get the job done. She took the unethical path. Therefore, she did not uphold the standards the Alskan people expected her to. There's no way around it.
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